You can't even take pictures at a public city beach anymore?

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 04:19:25 +0200, Mxsmanic
wrote:

people in free societies don't know what they've got until it's
gone.

Very often true. And moreso, they seldom stand up for themselves. I'm
a proud American, but so many many people I see around me could get
slapped in the face, and they'd only respond with "thank you sir, may
I have another"


---Atreju---

On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 20:29:26 -0400, "YoYo"
your.business.com wrote:

Yea believe or not it happens upstate,
central NY also :+(

And Washington, DC. I was out at the Cherry Blossom festival getting
some really nice shots along the tidal pool and this guy comes over
and starts giving me the same sort of grief (don't take pictures of
us) because they had walked INTO my shot. Another gentleman came over
and informed Mr. Angry that I had been setting up my shot (tripod and
camera) for about 15 minutes before Mr & Mrs Angry even came along. So
now Mr. Angry is yelling at Mr. Helpful to %@&% off when along comes
DC's finest (who says there's never a cop when you need one) who
listens to the story and then tells Mr. Angry to shut up and go away.
The cop then hangs out for a good 10 minutes to make sure Mr. Angry
doesn't come back.

For all the "threat level orange" terrorist paranoia around here it
was nice to have a law enforcement person actually stand up for a
photographer for a change!

What I still can't figure is why Mr. Angry lit into me. There must
have been 40 tourists in the immediate area all snapping away for all
they were worth. Maybe he felt threatened by my big lens grin.


Drifter
"I've been here, I've been there..."

"Atreju" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 04:19:25 +0200, Mxsmanic
wrote:

people in free societies don't know what they've got until it's
gone.

Very often true. And moreso, they seldom stand up for themselves. I'm
a proud American, but so many many people I see around me could get
slapped in the face, and they'd only respond with "thank you sir, may
I have another"


---Atreju---

I hate to tell the terrorists, but this is america, land of apathy. No one
is terrorized, or frankly, gives a crap anymore. 9/11 was forgotten within
months by 95% of the population.

Drifter writes:

What I still can't figure is why Mr. Angry lit into me. There must
have been 40 tourists in the immediate area all snapping away for all
they were worth. Maybe he felt threatened by my big lens grin.

There's a certain species of person who feels convinced that anyone who
is taking photos and looks professional MUST be taking pictures of him.

I'm consistently amazed and amused by people who will step out of a
crowd of 200 people on a street to ask why I'm taking pictures of THEM.
Talk about ego!

--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

Hunt writes:

This scene could just have easily played out, even without your camera, in
almost any "inner-city" neighborhood, had you just violated their turf, or
worn the wrong color ****.

I'm not sure I'd want to visit a neighborhood where people wear ****, no
matter what its color.

--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

dave writes:

I hate to tell the terrorists, but this is america, land of apathy. No one
is terrorized, or frankly, gives a crap anymore. 9/11 was forgotten within
months by 95% of the population.

The paranoia still seems to be going as strong as ever.

--
Transpose hotmail and mxsmanic in my e-mail address to reach me directly.

On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 21:22:47 -0400, "The Black Sheep"
wrote:


"JohnCM" wrote in message
. com...

I tell you, I'm really considering leaving New York or this country
altogether. Perhaps it's just because I am so mad now, but I just
can't live in a society that seems so paranoid anymore. I see the
MTA
Police and police all over train stations now. It's just no fun
anymore, heck, it's miserable. Today may be the last straw. I want
to
live in a country like the United States we used to have. You know,
the one where protesters got respect and were allowed to march, one
where you can freely take photos on public property, one where
people
trust eachother,etc. It's bad enough we lost the World Trade Center
and all those innocent lives, but now we're losing something even
more
valuable.

Move to Canada. I've been on Parliament Hill taking photos after
midnight, walking right up to the front door of Parliament, and the
only police attention I ever got was an RCMP officer nodding "good
evening" and another moving his car for me so it was out of my shot.

I know today's incident wasn't related at all to terrorism, but one
man's insane jealousy and paranoia, but still, it's part of the
paranoia society is inflicted with these days.

You are correct. Of course, there are jerks everywhere....

Next time something like this happens, advise the person that if they
touch you or threaten you again you will consider at assault. Ask
them to leave you alone, and if they don't tell them you will consider
it harrassment. Then dial 91 on your cell phone and ask them if you
should dial the last digit. Works like a charm.

Basically, in the US, the jerk yelling at a legal activity is
already committing assault. If he lays hands on you, it's battery. If
he tries to get your camera, you could likely throw in robbery --
after all, if a guy demands your property, what likelihood is there
that you'll get it back unharmed.

Then yell like hell to attract a crowd, preferably with
cameras, then start snapping pictures of the miscreants.

Of course, from what I hear of NY, that probably constitutes a
death sentence all by itself.

On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 20:39:44 -0500, Ron Hunter
wrote:

JohnCM wrote:

It was a warm and humid day with a stiff south breeze and a weak
tropical storm offshore. A good day to head to Long Beach,NY and get
some shots of the waves and sea spray. I was taking some pictures of
the rough surf today, and I took several shots of some real nice
breakers from the boardwalk. The beach was crowded, and some women
just happened to be sitting on the beach near the jetti.
Anyway I take a few pictures, do some more walking to the end of the
boardwalk to get a few more shots and then walk back. Shortly
thereafter, I am accosted by 3 men, who say they want to see my
camera. I told them it's none of their business, and asked if they
were cops. They said no. The one younger male (the head jerk) accused
me of taking pictures of his girlfriend on the beach. I told them I
wasn't, and was taking pictures of the surf. Then the head jerk said
"look me in the eye, I know what you're doing, taking pictures of
girls on the beach undressing". I then said "so what, it's a public
beach and I have every right to take pictures". He continues to
verbally assault me, and threaten to call the cops. Then I really get
mad and start yelling back.
I tell him that I am sick of people like you who stop and bother
photographers. First it's the trains because they're worried I'm a
terrorist, now it's the beach because you're worried I'm taking
pictures of your girlfriend. I said "listen pal, this is America and
as long as I am on public property neither you or anyone else will
stop me from taking pictures". He then continued to curse at me
telling me if he sees me again taking pictures he will beat the
(censored) out of me. At this point I decide not to waste anymore time
and tell them I am walking away and want to be left alone. They
continue to make verbal and physical threats, I was so enraged I gave
them the finger and told them to "mind their own (censored) business".
Other people saw this incident but refused to back me up.
Anyway I told a few of the witnesses that they should speak up like I
did, because the way things are going it seems, our freedoms and civil
liberties will be gone in no time, because no one cares to stand up
for what's right anymore.
I told a beach worker what happened, who offered to let me on the
beach for free (it costs to get on the sand at Long Beach during the
summer) but I told them I wasn't in the mood anymore and had to leave.
I saw a few other guys filming and taking photos of the beach and told
them what happened, just to be on the lookout for people who'll bug
you for taking pictures and so on.
I tell you, I'm really considering leaving New York or this country
altogether. Perhaps it's just because I am so mad now, but I just
can't live in a society that seems so paranoid anymore. I see the MTA
Police and police all over train stations now. It's just no fun
anymore, heck, it's miserable. Today may be the last straw. I want to
live in a country like the United States we used to have. You know,
the one where protesters got respect and were allowed to march, one
where you can freely take photos on public property, one where people
trust eachother,etc. It's bad enough we lost the World Trade Center
and all those innocent lives, but now we're losing something even more
valuable.
I know today's incident wasn't related at all to terrorism, but one
man's insane jealousy and paranoia, but still, it's part of the
paranoia society is inflicted with these days.

Gee, three obnoxious people and you indict the whole country? You are
in for some ugly shocks if you travel widely. I took 470 shots while on
vacation this year, and no one complained about any of them, even though
some of them might have been of interest to a terrorist. I rather
suspect that some paranoid people decided you were up to no good and
accosted you. Why didn't you offer to let them look at the pictures and
judge for themselves?

If I didn't like your looks (missle eastern, for example) and
asked to look through your wallet to see if you had evidence of
belonging to certain organizations, would you let me? How about if I
asked for a look at your genitals to see if you were an STD carrier?
Where do you draw the line? Or do you just knuckle under when accosted
by jerks?

Or maybe you didn't want to do that for cause?

No cause needed -- the Constitution gives the thugs no
authoority to abridge my legal behavior.

On Sun, 29 Aug 2004 04:19:25 +0200, Mxsmanic
wrote:

JohnCM writes:

I know today's incident wasn't related at all to terrorism, but one
man's insane jealousy and paranoia, but still, it's part of the
paranoia society is inflicted with these days.

Terrorism is actually just one flavor of paranoia. Terrorists depend on
hysteria and paranoia to accomplish their ends. The ironic and scary
part is that governments often depend on exactly the same things for
exactly the same reasons. In other words, terrorists and governments
often are working in the same way towards similar purposes. Terrorist
attacks give governments excuses to curtail civil liberties.

Democracies are their own worst enemies; they eventually commit suicide.
And people in free societies don't know what they've got until it's
gone.

Any true democracy contains the seeds of its own destruction
in that it sets limits beyond which it won't go to defend itself.

"Jeff Cochran" wrote in message
...
Jeez. Some guy thinks the original poster is taking pics of his girl
in a bikini (which he may have been) and defends her. The
photographer gets upset and combative as well. And it's all because
George Bush is President?

Somebody needs to take his Valium. Several somebodys it looks like.

Wrong.
If someone chooses to walk around nudie (or close to it), you and/or anyone
else has the right to photograph it. In fact, if they want to sell your
nudie pic to the National Enquirer, they can do that as well.