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#141
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/15/2014 11:44 PM, Eric Stevens wrote:
On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 21:51:52 -0400, nospam wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: You really have difficulty in expressing what you mean. You previously wrote "a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost" when you really meant a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost as it should be stored in a copy else where. there is no need to say that since the default is for a copy of the data in the cloud. Then you should have said it was for the default case. Otherwise it's a generalisation which isn't always correct. the default does not need to be spelled out. that's why it's called the default. The trouble was that it was not said to be the default case (rather than the general case) until well into the argument. Nor was the exact nature of the default defined as such until well into the argument. The problem with your failure to exactly define your terms until after the argument is underway is that you use it to duck and weave and genereally confuse the argument. not only that, but one of the key advantages of the cloud multiple devices having access, so it's probably in many places. dropbox is a good example. now ask yourself how many people have only one copy of their data on a hard drive. the answer is a lot. *they* are the ones who are going to lose data. Ditto with people and laptops and phones. no, because a phone is often backed up to the cloud without the user needing to do much of anything. You have ignored my mention of phones for which the overflow is *stored* - not backed up but *stored* in the cloud. The people who do that are certain their data is secure. Now you say smartphones are "*more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail" when you really meant smartphones are *more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail except buttons and switches which do not store data. data storage is either on a hard drive or flash memory, not buttons and switches. So? it means that the device can have all buttons and switches removed and the data will be there and readable. Who said anything about their removal? You shouldn't think only in terms of software failures. I know of many cases where failure of devices such as switches, contacts, sensors, gates etc have had quite unintended consequences. I certainly would not rule out the possibility of the loss of data in the event of a failure of buttons and switches. when someone says no moving parts with regards to data storage, they mean no spinning disk. Oh, do they? Is that what you meant? Then why didn't you say so? because it's obvious. data is stored on a hard drive or ssd. not buttons. only an idiot would bring up buttons, and sure enough, one did. And another idiot couln't see the obvious. only an idiot would bring up switches. they do move but that makes no difference to the data. even if every button and switch was broken, the data is unaffected. Are you really saying that it is not possible for the failure of a button or switch to cause the loss of data? You will have to be very brave to say that: just because you don't know or can't think of an example doesn't mean it can't happen. yes. data is not stored in a button or switch. Gee - that's simplistic thinking. and correct. It's not stored by switches but it's controlled by switches. See above. He is wrong and is now, as usual, he trying t wriggle out of it. -- PeterN |
#142
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/15/2014 11:59 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , Eric Stevens wrote: You really have difficulty in expressing what you mean. You previously wrote "a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost" when you really meant a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost as it should be stored in a copy else where. there is no need to say that since the default is for a copy of the data in the cloud. Then you should have said it was for the default case. Otherwise it's a generalisation which isn't always correct. the default does not need to be spelled out. that's why it's called the default. The trouble was that it was not said to be the default case (rather than the general case) until well into the argument. Nor was the exact nature of the default defined as such until well into the argument. The problem with your failure to exactly define your terms until after the argument is underway is that you use it to duck and weave and genereally confuse the argument. no, you're blaming your misunderstanding on me when it's you. there is no need to specify the default case since it's the default case. not only that, but one of the key advantages of the cloud multiple devices having access, so it's probably in many places. dropbox is a good example. now ask yourself how many people have only one copy of their data on a hard drive. the answer is a lot. *they* are the ones who are going to lose data. Ditto with people and laptops and phones. no, because a phone is often backed up to the cloud without the user needing to do much of anything. You have ignored my mention of phones for which the overflow is *stored* - not backed up but *stored* in the cloud. The people who do that are certain their data is secure. anyone that believes one copy of data is secure is in for a surprise. and again, that's not the default case. Another fallback statement you use, to keep from admiting you are wrong. -- PeterN |
#143
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/16/2014 6:14 AM, Sandman wrote:
In article , PeterN wrote: PeterN: Which model of any smart phone has no moving parts? nospam: all of them. buttons and switches do not count since those do not store data and even if one fails, the data is intact. you really have no clue, do you? Eric Stevens: You really have difficulty in expressing what you mean. You previously wrote "a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost" when you really meant a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost as it should be stored in a copy else where. Now you say smartphones are "*more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail" when you really meant smartphones are *more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail except buttons and switches which do not store data. Are you really saying that it is not possible for the failure of a button or switch to cause the loss of data? You will have to be very brave to say that: just because you don't know or can't think of an example doesn't mean it can't happen. Funny. The problem with my old iPhone was a broken internal switch. What "switch" was this? You say it's an internal component, and the topic was "moving parts" so you seem to imply that inside your iPhone there was a mechanical physically moving "switch" that was broken. Having seen the insides of many iPhones (I have a friend that repair them), I can assure you that no such switch exists. The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Nobody, except you, said my phone was not backed up. Typically, you make assumptions with no factual basis. Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. Decline what?? The discussion was about the data on my hone, not on my backup, or restoration to a new phone. So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). I never said otherwise. -- PeterN |
#144
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/16/2014 6:14 AM, Sandman wrote:
In article , PeterN wrote: PeterN: Which model of any smart phone has no moving parts? nospam: all of them. buttons and switches do not count since those do not store data and even if one fails, the data is intact. you really have no clue, do you? Eric Stevens: You really have difficulty in expressing what you mean. You previously wrote "a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost" when you really meant a cloud outage might be annoying, but the data won't be lost as it should be stored in a copy else where. Now you say smartphones are "*more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail" when you really meant smartphones are *more* secure since there are no moving parts to fail except buttons and switches which do not store data. Are you really saying that it is not possible for the failure of a button or switch to cause the loss of data? You will have to be very brave to say that: just because you don't know or can't think of an example doesn't mean it can't happen. Funny. The problem with my old iPhone was a broken internal switch. What "switch" was this? You say it's an internal component, and the topic was "moving parts" so you seem to imply that inside your iPhone there was a mechanical physically moving "switch" that was broken. Having seen the insides of many iPhones (I have a friend that repair them), I can assure you that no such switch exists. The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). I apologize to you for my snippy answers. I thought I was responding to nosense, and sent before review. -- PeterN |
#145
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/16/2014 10:39 AM, nospam wrote:
In article , Sandman wrote: Funny. The problem with my old iPhone was a broken internal switch. What "switch" was this? You say it's an internal component, and the topic was "moving parts" so you seem to imply that inside your iPhone there was a mechanical physically moving "switch" that was broken. Having seen the insides of many iPhones (I have a friend that repair them), I can assure you that no such switch exists. he's talking out is ass. there is no 'internal switch'. the *only* buttons and switches are on the outside (not inside), where a user can access them. an internal switch makes no sense whatsoever. the status of any of those buttons/switches or whether any of them are even functional do not affect data retention or being able to access the data at all. there are even ways to continue to use an iphone/ipad with broken buttons/switches although obviously less convenient than getting it repaired, which for an out of warranty device may not be worth it. and for those who don't want to disassemble their iphone to check what's really in there, just check out any of the teardowns online. The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). a backup certainly makes things easier, but the data in his old phone was still there. he's wrong. Sorry, I forgot you were aware of what the Apple Store people told me. -- PeterN |
#146
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
In article , PeterN
wrote: Funny. The problem with my old iPhone was a broken internal switch. The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. the phone may not have been usable as a phone, but the *data* on it was not lost. it's still there. The data may have been there, but it could not be accessed. It would not sync with any computer. It could not be read by any computer. Not even at the Apple store. your story keeps changing. it won't sync with anything other than the computer to which it was first synced. once again, you don't know what you're talking about. however, the data was there. not only that, but a 'broken internal switch' isn't going to cause a sync failure. the switches do *not* matter. the apple store staff wanted to fix the phone so you could use it as a phone. that's to be expected. The folks in th Apple store disagree with you. no. their job is to fix stuff, not recover them. if you want data recovery, try http://www.drivesavers.com/. Once more yu have no idea WTF you are talking about. i know *far* more about ios devices that you ever will. And you selectively take comments out of context. But it doesn't matter. We all know what you are, and act accordingly. nothing was removed. you are wrong again. And just where did I used the word "removed." Do learn to read. you said "selectively take comments out of context". the entire post was quoted (again) and nothing was removed at all, therefore nothing could be taken out of context. do learn to read. |
#147
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
In article , PeterN
wrote: The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Nobody, except you, said my phone was not backed up. Typically, you make assumptions with no factual basis. if it was backed up then it doesn't matter what failed or if you even had the original phone at all. bottom line: nothing lost, exactly as i said. Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. Decline what?? The discussion was about the data on my hone, not on my backup, or restoration to a new phone. no, the discussion is data loss. since you admit to having a backup, there can't be data loss. |
#148
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
In article , PeterN
wrote: The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). I apologize to you for my snippy answers. I thought I was responding to nosense, and sent before review. you meant to say you respond *with* nonsense. next time review it before sending. |
#149
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
In article , PeterN
wrote: So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). a backup certainly makes things easier, but the data in his old phone was still there. he's wrong. Sorry, I forgot you were aware of what the Apple Store people told me. i didn't say anything about what they said or didn't say. stop making **** up. |
#150
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Adobe's Low hanging .... ?
On 7/16/2014 12:56 PM, nospam wrote:
In article , PeterN wrote: The phone would turn on and off, but nothing could be accessed. According t the good folks at the Apple store the diagnostic code was a bad internal switch, or something like that. It cold not be repaired. Perhaps I should have sent nospam to argue with them. Since the topic was data loss, are you here claiming that this internal "switch" failing also made your phone backup fail? Or are you saying that in spite of your iPhone explictly asking you to, and Apple providing it for free, you declined automatic backup of your phone? Because if you didn't decline, and you had backup, then your replacement iPhone would just ask for your iCloud credentials and then just restore your new phone with all the data from your old phone. So regardless of this "internal switch" whatever that is supposed to mean, your phone data - while unrecoverable inside your old phone - was not actually lost since you're smart enough to utilize the automatic and free of charge backup mechanism in iCloud (or the automatic free of charge backup mechanism in iTunes if you distrust the cloud). I apologize to you for my snippy answers. I thought I was responding to nosense, and sent before review. you meant to say you respond *with* nonsense. next time review it before sending. You really are an asshole. -- PeterN |
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