[OT - US/Canada] E-85

"William Graham" wrote in message
...

"Robert Brace" wrote in message
news:caOeg.208779$P01.64311@pd7tw3no...

"William Graham" wrote in message
. ..

"Robert Brace" wrote in message
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"William Graham" wrote in message
. ..

"All Things Mopar" wrote in message

A friend of mine is on his 3rd Chrysler Grand Caravan, and
while the model has been basically reliable he's had a water
pump die (in first year), .....

Now that brings up a memory....I struggled with bad water pumps for
years until one day, I looked under the hood of some Japanese product,
and saw a water pump that was external to the engine, driven by the
fan belt, or some auxiliary belt driven from the front pulley...."What
a refreshing idea" I remember thinking....You don't have to virtually
overhaul your engine in order to replace the water pump....You can
just go down to the parts store, and buy another one like you would a
generator, and install it in a few minutes......Now, why couldn't the
American designers think of that?

William, methinks you are confused.
I don't want to burst your bubble, but, taking your vintage into
consideration, and your self-professed dislike of American autos, I
cannot fathom what American cars had the internal (and not driven by a
fan or auxiliary belt) water pump whereof you speak.
The fanbelt driven water pump has been on the American auto production
for years (virtually since day 1). In fact, it was the original design
lifted from Chevrolet which Toyota copied for their first "real" car
(right down to the Chev's original part number cast into it).
Bob



Yes....I wasn't speaking of fan driven particularly, but the concept of
mounting it in the heads of the engine....You are right, they have all
been driven by the fan belt, but they haven't been stand alone, separate
from the engine pumps....What I liked about this Japanese car's pump was
that it was so easy to replace because it was separated from the head
like a generator. It's only connection to the engine was through water
hoses......

That makes it somewhat clearer now. Can you remember which Japanese
vehicle it was and roughly when. The NA trend in design has always been
to cut down on the number of external hoses and connections needed
outside the engine in an effort to reduce leak points and the tendency
for hoses to deteriorate over time. Some weight savings can be realized
by going to the external location instead of relying on water jacketed
positioning and that is gradually being seen across the industry.
Bob

Can't remember, but it was a cheap little sedan, like the Chevy
Sprint....I think it was around 1980 to 85.......I'm not even sure it was
Japanese. for all I know, it WAS a Chevy Sprint.....:^)

A Chevy Sprint is Japanese, It is a Suzuki manufactured by NUMI (New United
Motors Industries). They manufacture for both GM and Suzuki (under both
badges). They still manufacture for GM and Suzuki under newer badge names,
of course. NUMI has a plant in Ontario, Canada and could have one in USA as
well. Next time I get close to one, I must have a look at the water pump,
out of curiosity.
Bob

"TMG" wrote in message
...
dwight wrote:

And you call ME knee-jerk? Well, whoosh again.

Yep,...and I bet I get you to respond again.

Why not? You did.

dwight

(Here we go...)

William Graham wrote:
"All Things Mopar" wrote in message
. ..

The problem with E-85 at the start of this thread is still the
same now, and will be the same years from now: ethanol is
negatively efficient so it doesn't matter how many million cars
can burn it, the net result will be more waste, not less.


This is so stupid. Any fuel that has to be manufactured is less efficient
than one that already exists, and is just sitting in a pool under the
ground, waiting to be sucked up and burned.

You misunderstand the concept of "refinery" and what it adds to the cost
stream.

You also seem to dismiss the taxes rightly added - those that can be
proportionally added - roads, bridges, enforcement, etc. Maybe those
come free in your world.


comparing ethanol which has to be made with gasoline,

You're not doing all that well. Ethanol production doesn't have anything
to do with gasoline production. Maybe you need to read up on beer or
wine production, and *THEN* read about large scale ethanol plants.

Now, with this "new" world firmly fixed in your
mind, tell me how you are going to drive down to the liquor store for your 6
pack of brew.........

Now Willy, you *KNOW* large scale ethanol production is on-line and
running while you type otherwise. You can pull your car right up to the
pump and fill up.

Why do you do that?

William Graham wrote:

I think a large portion of the national debt is owed to US citizens and
corporations who have purchased T bills and other government bonds.

So, when the US *must* default (or at the very least devalue the US
dollar) you'll be "OK" with that.

I assume (if you have an iota to common sense), your buying forward in
several currencies that aren't US.

If not, why not?

Isn't your theory about the solvency of the US intertwined with its
future obligations?

When you did the math (as I'm sure you did), how did you balance the
"set in stone" future obligations against the projected future incomes?

Let's see:

You will increase Federal income to match obligations.

or

You will decrease the real cost of future outflows.

Plan A (increase federal income) pretty much means an increased transfer
from the tax base. There are many ways to do it, but revenue has to
increase.

Plan B has some wiggle room. The cost of future outflows has *lots* of
variables. Including the value of the US dollar.

dwight wrote:
"TMG" wrote in message
...

dwight wrote:


And you call ME knee-jerk? Well, whoosh again.

Yep,...and I bet I get you to respond again.


Why not? You did.

dwight

(Here we go...)

Yeah - but I get paid every time I get you to respond.

Please to be inserting response HERE --

"TMG" wrote in message
. ..
William Graham wrote:

I think a large portion of the national debt is owed to US citizens and
corporations who have purchased T bills and other government bonds.

So, when the US *must* default (or at the very least devalue the US
dollar) you'll be "OK" with that.

I assume (if you have an iota to common sense), your buying forward in
several currencies that aren't US.

If not, why not?

Isn't your theory about the solvency of the US intertwined with its future
obligations?

When you did the math (as I'm sure you did), how did you balance the "set
in stone" future obligations against the projected future incomes?

Let's see:

You will increase Federal income to match obligations.

or

You will decrease the real cost of future outflows.

Plan A (increase federal income) pretty much means an increased transfer
from the tax base. There are many ways to do it, but revenue has to
increase.

Plan B has some wiggle room. The cost of future outflows has *lots* of
variables. Including the value of the US dollar.

Did I say that It matters who the national debt is owed to? - All I did was
correct someone who said that, "We owed it to our enemies". We will never
default on the debt. We don't have to. All we will do is pay it off with
inflated money, which is the same thing as stealing it, or defaulting on the
loan. It is the time honored way that all governments have of stealing from
their people....

William Graham wrote:

Plan B has some wiggle room. The cost of future outflows has *lots* of
variables. Including the value of the US dollar.


Did I say that It matters who the national debt is owed to? - All I did was
correct someone who said that, "We owed it to our enemies". We will never
default on the debt. We don't have to. All we will do is pay it off with
inflated money,

I like Plan B too. Pay them off in useless inflated dollars - or in
devalued dollars (same thing).

which is the same thing as stealing it, or defaulting on the
loan. It is the time honored way that all governments have of stealing from
their people....

Well, not just "their people" - but that's good too. It it's done right,
the US can screw non-US holders *slightly* more than the domestic
holders. But just slightly.

All in all, something to look forward to.

Robert Brace wrote:
"William Graham" wrote in message
...

"Robert Brace" wrote in message
news:caOeg.208779$P01.64311@pd7tw3no...

"William Graham" wrote in message
om...

"Robert Brace" wrote in message
news:3yKeg.206999$7a.175471@pd7tw1no...

"William Graham" wrote in message
news:t5WdnUCYKZyNpObZnZ2dnUVZ_vOdnZ2d@comcast .com...

"All Things Mopar" wrote in message

A friend of mine is on his 3rd Chrysler Grand Caravan, and

while the model has been basically reliable he's had a water
pump die (in first year), .....

Now that brings up a memory....I struggled with bad water pumps for
years until one day, I looked under the hood of some Japanese product,
and saw a water pump that was external to the engine, driven by the
fan belt, or some auxiliary belt driven from the front pulley...."What
a refreshing idea" I remember thinking....You don't have to virtually
overhaul your engine in order to replace the water pump....You can
just go down to the parts store, and buy another one like you would a
generator, and install it in a few minutes......Now, why couldn't the
American designers think of that?

William, methinks you are confused.
I don't want to burst your bubble, but, taking your vintage into
consideration, and your self-professed dislike of American autos, I
cannot fathom what American cars had the internal (and not driven by a
fan or auxiliary belt) water pump whereof you speak.
The fanbelt driven water pump has been on the American auto production
for years (virtually since day 1). In fact, it was the original design
lifted from Chevrolet which Toyota copied for their first "real" car
(right down to the Chev's original part number cast into it).
Bob




Yes....I wasn't speaking of fan driven particularly, but the concept of
mounting it in the heads of the engine....You are right, they have all
been driven by the fan belt, but they haven't been stand alone, separate
from the engine pumps....What I liked about this Japanese car's pump was
that it was so easy to replace because it was separated from the head
like a generator. It's only connection to the engine was through water
hoses......

That makes it somewhat clearer now. Can you remember which Japanese
vehicle it was and roughly when. The NA trend in design has always been
to cut down on the number of external hoses and connections needed
outside the engine in an effort to reduce leak points and the tendency
for hoses to deteriorate over time. Some weight savings can be realized
by going to the external location instead of relying on water jacketed
positioning and that is gradually being seen across the industry.
Bob


Can't remember, but it was a cheap little sedan, like the Chevy
Sprint....I think it was around 1980 to 85.......I'm not even sure it was
Japanese. for all I know, it WAS a Chevy Sprint.....:^)


A Chevy Sprint is Japanese, It is a Suzuki manufactured by NUMI (New United
Motors Industries). They manufacture for both GM and Suzuki (under both
badges). They still manufacture for GM and Suzuki under newer badge names,
of course. NUMI has a plant in Ontario, Canada and could have one in USA as
well. Next time I get close to one, I must have a look at the water pump,
out of curiosity.
Bob



NUMI's American assembly plant is located in Fremont, California.

ALV

Today, with great enthusiasm and quite emphatically, William
Graham laid this on an unsuspecting readership ...

Did I say that It matters who the national debt is owed to? -
All I did was correct someone who said that, "We owed it to
our enemies". We will never default on the debt. We don't have
to. All we will do is pay it off with inflated money, which is
the same thing as stealing it, or defaulting on the loan. It
is the time honored way that all governments have of stealing
from their people....

In my book, since it was me that said this, here's how to define
"enemy", a real maxim:

"My enemy's enemy is my friend, and my enemy's friend is my
enemy" - Middle East Maxim

If you want to put your head in the sand and pretend that
borrowing from the oil kings /you/ are trying to put out of
business, that's fine by me, but they are still our enemies.
Hmmm. Seems like we can't make up our minds whether Iran or Iraq
is our ally or our enemy. Sometimes it is one, other times the
other. Still other times, we hate both of them. And, our
"friends" in China, where we're also sending billions /per month/
will soon be flooding our economy with cars built at wages of
less than $1/hour.

Care to debate "enemy" any more? One more time: if a country -
any country - costs the United States jobs, taxes, standard of
living, freedom, security, treasury bleeding, lives lost, or
people maimed for life, you can bet your ass they /are/ our blood
enemy!

As to defaulting on the public debt, the economy of the entire
world depends on "the full faith and credit of the United
States". So what happens when the markers get called in, pay it
off in gold from Fort Knox? As to repaying in inflated dollars,
that might've made sense when inflation was rising faster than
the debt, but it is not.

As I said earlier, President George Walker Bush has the ignomius
distinction of creating larger deficits than all other
presidents, /combined/, and he is still bent on cutting taxes
while the money just flows out. For some perspective, just the
interest on the national debt is something north of $150 for
every man, woman, and child in the country - every month!

--
ATM, aka Jerry

"English is a language hard to understand, but easy to
misunderstand" - Unknown or George Bernard Shaw

Today, with great enthusiasm and quite emphatically, Andrew
Venor laid this on an unsuspecting readership ...

A Chevy Sprint is Japanese, It is a Suzuki manufactured by
NUMI (New United Motors Industries). They manufacture for
both GM and Suzuki (under both badges). They still
manufacture for GM and Suzuki under newer badge names, of
course. NUMI has a plant in Ontario, Canada and could have
one in USA as well. Next time I get close to one, I must
have a look at the water pump, out of curiosity. Bob

NUMI's American assembly plant is located in Fremont,
California.

Yes, but it is NUMMI - New United Motor Manufacturing, Inc. and is
the long-running partnership of GM and Toyota. See
http://www.nummi.com/

--
ATM, aka Jerry

"English is a language hard to understand, but easy to
misunderstand" - Unknown or George Bernard Shaw