Film reels jamming (Developer tank)

March 15, 2008, from Lloyd Erlick,

I use Jobo 1501 plastic developing reels that
adjust to accept either 35 mm or 120 format
film. I find the problem you describe occurs
with both, but mostly 120. I think it is
caused by the leading corners of the film
binding against the spokes or ribs that make
up the structure of the reel. The sharp
pointy corners at the leading edge of the
film strip are the culprit, I think.

I have found the (more-or-less) fix for it. I
use a variant of the corner-snip -- I fold
the leading corners of the film just before I
feed it into the opening of the spiral groove
(this way we remain groovy even in the
digital era ...).

The 'amount' of film folded up is the
smallest possible to grasp with my bare
fingers. ('Up' meaning the folded corner
points away from the centre of the reel, or
away from the emulsion side of the film.) I
try to create a little equilateral triangle
at each leading corner. I squash it flat, but
do not expect it to stay there. However, it
slopes 'backwards' (towards the hand)
slightly, and that is enough to permit it to
slip nicely under the 'top' of the groove.
There is discernable resistance when the fold
goes into the spiral, but it is only slight.

Since adopting this procedure, I've had close
to zero snags while loading film.

Making the small folds is quick and easy in
the dark, since the film is right there in
the hands. I don't know if the snipped corner
method works as well or better. I hate the
fumble in the dark of finding the small tip
of the corner with a pair of nail clippers.
I'm also not thrilled to fantasize about
where those little corner snippings have got
to. I worry about Murphy ...

regards,
--le
________________________________
Lloyd Erlick Portraits, Toronto.
website: www.heylloyd.com
telephone: 416-686-0326
email:
________________________________
--






On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 11:32:37 +0100,
Christopher Loffredo wrote:

Hi,


When I try to reel film onto my developing tank reels (Jobo and
Patterson, both 35mm and 120), the film jams and, even tapping or
knocking the reel, I often can't get the whole film loaded.

And, yes, the reels are perfectly dry.

Any other suggestions or tricks?

Thanks!

On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 11:37:41 -0500, "Nicholas
O. Lindan" wrote:

I have never encountered photoflo residue. I have been using
the same reels with photoflo for 40+ years, and all I ever
do is rinse them in hot water. No residue yet.



March 15, 2008, from Lloyd Erlick,

I haven't used wetting agent since 1969 ...
and I have no residue either.

regards,
--le

Bogdan Karasek wrote:
HI,

I've been using Paterson reels for about 10 years now. The film gets
stuck occasionally, maybe a doz times in ten years. Those I mark and
put aside. The usual cause of jamming is because the reel is not
completely dry.

Cheers, Bogdan


Hi,

I've been using Paterson reels (off & on) for about 30 years. :-)

It's just that I've had a 10 year pause, and now in a different country
and with developing tanks recently bought through internet actions, I
find this problem being regular instead of very occasional as you mention.

I'll soon try some of the more produtive suggestions:

I normally never rinse my reels & tanks after using Photoflo; in the
past that was never a problem, now it might be since I am using a
different (and very old) type of wetting agent (possibly also the cause
of spots on my negatives - will change imediately). My reels are now
soaking in hot water.

Also, my bathroom is very humid, I will certainly keep my tank out of it
until just before loading the film.

I'll post the results of the "new regime" in a couple of days....

Thanks for all input so far.

Chris

"jch" wrote

film drying cabinet ... put one or more plastic Paterson reels to be
loaded in the cabinet

Humid weather and/or sweat on the hands is a guaranteed jam,
crinkle and crease when loading film.

I haven't tried loading film with latex/nitrile gloves but
it might help in hot weather. My fix is to wait for the
cool of the evening. That's not much of a wait this time
of year.

I've been promised global warming for 20 years now, but
the weather is as cold and miserable as ever.

--
Nicholas O. Lindan, Cleveland, Ohio
Darkroom Automation: F-Stop Timers, Enlarging Meters
http://www.darkroomautomation.com/index2.htm
n o lindan at ix dot netcom dot com

"Christopher Loffredo" wrote in message
...
Bogdan Karasek wrote:
HI,

I've been using Paterson reels for about 10 years now.
The film gets stuck occasionally, maybe a doz times in
ten years. Those I mark and put aside. The usual cause
of jamming is because the reel is not completely dry.

Cheers, Bogdan


Hi,

I've been using Paterson reels (off & on) for about 30
years. :-)

It's just that I've had a 10 year pause, and now in a
different country and with developing tanks recently
bought through internet actions, I find this problem being
regular instead of very occasional as you mention.

I'll soon try some of the more produtive suggestions:

I normally never rinse my reels & tanks after using
Photoflo; in the past that was never a problem, now it
might be since I am using a different (and very old) type
of wetting agent (possibly also the cause of spots on my
negatives - will change imediately). My reels are now
soaking in hot water.

Also, my bathroom is very humid, I will certainly keep my
tank out of it until just before loading the film.

I'll post the results of the "new regime" in a couple of
days....

Thanks for all input so far.

Chris


If you think the sticking is caused by some sort of
residue you can try cleaning the reels with a toothbrush and
toothpaste. Toothpaste has a very mild abrasive in it along
with a detergent and will clean and polish surfaces without
damaging them (except don't use it on lenses).
Although sticking is very often attributed to residue
from wetting agent I suspect it is mostly due to the reels
being slightly out of parallel or not being quite the right
width. Hot water washing after use should eliminate any
residue and, if the film is washed on the reel, there really
shouldn't be any residue at all.
I have used stainless steel tanks for many years and
seldom have loading problems. When I do they usually happen
in hot weather or when loading in a changing bag where
moisture from my hands makes the film limp and perhaps
swells it slightly. It helps to trim off the corners even
when using stainless steel reels.
I use a final rinse composed of Photo-Flo at half
strength and isopropyl alcohol. For a liter of rinse add
about 30ml of 70% rubbing alcohol (make sure it doesn't have
oil of wintergreen or anything else in it). The amount is
not critical so you can use the same amount of 91% or
anhydrous alcohol. Photo-Flow at half recommended strength,
half a capful for a liter. Soak the film in this for about a
minute before hanging up to dry.
Edwal wetting agent appears to be the same stuff as
Photo-Flo plus some alcohol.
I usually wash out the tanks and reels in hot water as
soon as I finish using them.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA

This works first time every time

Bill



"Lloyd Erlick" Lloyd at @the-wire. dot com wrote in message
...
March 15, 2008, from Lloyd Erlick,

I use Jobo 1501 plastic developing reels that
adjust to accept either 35 mm or 120 format
film. I find the problem you describe occurs
with both, but mostly 120. I think it is
caused by the leading corners of the film
binding against the spokes or ribs that make
up the structure of the reel. The sharp
pointy corners at the leading edge of the
film strip are the culprit, I think.

I have found the (more-or-less) fix for it. I
use a variant of the corner-snip -- I fold
the leading corners of the film just before I
feed it into the opening of the spiral groove
(this way we remain groovy even in the
digital era ...).

The 'amount' of film folded up is the
smallest possible to grasp with my bare
fingers. ('Up' meaning the folded corner
points away from the centre of the reel, or
away from the emulsion side of the film.) I
try to create a little equilateral triangle
at each leading corner. I squash it flat, but
do not expect it to stay there. However, it
slopes 'backwards' (towards the hand)
slightly, and that is enough to permit it to
slip nicely under the 'top' of the groove.
There is discernable resistance when the fold
goes into the spiral, but it is only slight.

Since adopting this procedure, I've had close
to zero snags while loading film.

Making the small folds is quick and easy in
the dark, since the film is right there in
the hands. I don't know if the snipped corner
method works as well or better. I hate the
fumble in the dark of finding the small tip
of the corner with a pair of nail clippers.
I'm also not thrilled to fantasize about
where those little corner snippings have got
to. I worry about Murphy ...

regards,
--le
________________________________
Lloyd Erlick Portraits, Toronto.
website: www.heylloyd.com
telephone: 416-686-0326
email:
________________________________
--






On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 11:32:37 +0100,
Christopher Loffredo wrote:

Hi,


When I try to reel film onto my developing tank reels (Jobo and
Patterson, both 35mm and 120), the film jams and, even tapping or
knocking the reel, I often can't get the whole film loaded.

And, yes, the reels are perfectly dry.

Any other suggestions or tricks?

Thanks!

"Lloyd Erlick" Lloyd at @the-wire. dot com wrote in message
...
March 15, 2008, from Lloyd Erlick,

I use Jobo 1501 plastic developing reels that
adjust to accept either 35 mm or 120 format
film. I find the problem you describe occurs
with both, but mostly 120. I think it is
caused by the leading corners of the film
binding against the spokes or ribs that make
up the structure of the reel. The sharp
pointy corners at the leading edge of the
film strip are the culprit, I think.

I have found the (more-or-less) fix for it. I
use a variant of the corner-snip -- I fold
the leading corners of the film just before I
feed it into the opening of the spiral groove
(this way we remain groovy even in the
digital era ...).

The 'amount' of film folded up is the
smallest possible to grasp with my bare
fingers. ('Up' meaning the folded corner
points away from the centre of the reel, or
away from the emulsion side of the film.) I
try to create a little equilateral triangle
at each leading corner. I squash it flat, but
do not expect it to stay there. However, it
slopes 'backwards' (towards the hand)
slightly, and that is enough to permit it to
slip nicely under the 'top' of the groove.
There is discernable resistance when the fold
goes into the spiral, but it is only slight.

Since adopting this procedure, I've had close
to zero snags while loading film.

Making the small folds is quick and easy in
the dark, since the film is right there in
the hands. I don't know if the snipped corner
method works as well or better. I hate the
fumble in the dark of finding the small tip
of the corner with a pair of nail clippers.
I'm also not thrilled to fantasize about
where those little corner snippings have got
to. I worry about Murphy ...

regards,
--le
________________________________
Lloyd Erlick Portraits, Toronto.
website: www.heylloyd.com
telephone: 416-686-0326
email:
________________________________
--






On Sat, 15 Mar 2008 11:32:37 +0100,
Christopher Loffredo wrote:

Hi,


When I try to reel film onto my developing tank reels (Jobo and
Patterson, both 35mm and 120), the film jams and, even tapping or
knocking the reel, I often can't get the whole film loaded.

And, yes, the reels are perfectly dry.

Any other suggestions or tricks?

Thanks!



This will work ... First time every time

Bill

On Mar 15, 3:32*am, Christopher Loffredo wrote:
Hi,

When I try to reel film onto my developing tank reels (Jobo and
Patterson, both 35mm and 120), the film jams and, even tapping or
knocking the reel, I often can't get the whole film loaded.

And, yes, the reels are perfectly dry.

Any other suggestions or tricks?

Thanks!

If these are self feeding reels check to see if the BB is missing out
of one side of the reels. That drove me crazy for a while until I
realized that one was missing. Hope this helps.

In article ,
"br" wrote:

This will work ... First time every time

Bill

Is there a good reason you are top and bottom posting, as well as
reposting his entire response without snipping -twice?

--
Reality is a picture perfected and never looking back.

"____" wrote in message
...
In article ,
"br" wrote:

This will work ... First time every time

Bill

Is there a good reason you are top and bottom posting, as well as
reposting his entire response without snipping -twice?

--
Reality is a picture perfected and never looking back.


no ... simply made a mistake
bill