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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?



 
 
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  #221  
Old April 14th 14, 10:17 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 13,611
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

On Mon, 14 Apr 2014 08:55:41 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically
there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before.
for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce
the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to
learn how to use it.

Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has
content aware fill.

and a zillion more features.


How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features?


you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if
you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have.


Agreed, but there is a learning time.
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #222  
Old April 15th 14, 03:10 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
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Posts: 24,165
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically
there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before.
for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce
the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to
learn how to use it.

Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has
content aware fill.

and a zillion more features.

How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features?


you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if
you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have.


Agreed, but there is a learning time.


it's not as long as you might think.
  #223  
Old April 15th 14, 03:10 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
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Posts: 24,165
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

It was old and familiar software, with a few new bells and
whistles, riding on a faster horse.


In what way is Windows 8 "old and familliar" to a Windows XP user?


I will tell you when I get W8. Are you implying that it is so
considerably different I will have to start learning about it from the
ground up? If it is like that it might be enough to drive me to OSX.


win8 is different enough that it has driven a lot of people to osx,
however, microsoft is addressing many of the things that people do not
like, so you might be ok.
  #224  
Old April 15th 14, 03:21 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Sandman
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Posts: 5,467
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Eric Stevens wrote:

Sandman:
Imagine that list after someone switched to Lightroom - and
all the things they're suddely doing quicker, ey?

Eric Stevens:
But only after learning how to use light room.


Sandman:
No, that's calculated in. I.e.even after including the time it
takes "learned" Lightroom, you're still ahead in terms of
efficiency.


I suppose that's true if you process your images while you learn.


Nope, even if it's a seperate process.

I was thinking of learning first and then processing your target images.


As was I:

Sandman:
For the record - Lightroom is super easy to ue and learn. You can
be up and running in five minutes and then learn new things while
using it.


Eric Stevens:
In the examples I quoted (which you snipped) very little new
learning was required.


Sandman:
Sure it was, you spoke about new versions of the operating system,
that can require at least as much learning as Lightroom to use to
its full extent.


The only occasions I can remember where I had to put some effort
into learning the operating system was at my first contact with
Windows 3 and later with NT4. The progress up the chain to W7 took
relatively little efort.


Then I guess you haven't upgraded to Windows 8, which would be the
contemporary version in this discussion. It requires some heavy duty
rethinking in many areas.

Eric Stevens:
It was old and familiar software, with a few new bells and
whistles, riding on a faster horse.


Sandman:
In what way is Windows 8 "old and familliar" to a Windows XP user?


I will tell you when I get W8. Are you implying that it is so
considerably different I will have to start learning about it from
the ground up? If it is like that it might be enough to drive me to
OSX.


Windows 8 requires you to learn a whole lot of new things, yes. I won't be
comparing it to anything specific, but there's a lot of new stuff and ways
to do stuff in W8.



--
Sandman[.net]
  #225  
Old April 15th 14, 03:26 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Sandman
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Posts: 5,467
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Tony Cooper wrote:

Sandman:
False logic. If person A usually walks to the store and person B
suggests to use a bicycle to get there faster and bring back more
products, then the veracity of that claim doesn't hinge on person
B providing examples of his own endevours with a bicycle. He may
not even own or need a bicycle and the claim would still remain
true.


What are "endevours" [sic] one does on a bicycle? You might try
"experiences" in that sentence, but I know you'd rather stay with
your rather odd uses of English.


Classic troll tactic - spelling/grammar flame instead of trying to argue
the point.

Tony Cooper:
You're making all about you because - evidently - it's improved
your previously ineffective workflow so you think everyone else
must benefit by doing what you say you do.


Sandman:
How is this "evident", Tony? nospam has said exactly nothing about
his own experience with Lightroom, or if he even uses it.


You're the expert at finding previously made statements. You could
find dozens that show that he uses LR.


Class troll misinterpretation - who claimed he didn't use Lightroom? No one
did. You made a claim that it was evident that Lightroom had improved
nospam's supposed inefficient workflow. I asked you how that is evident,
nospam has not told us about any inefficient workflow and how - if at all -
Lightroom has improved it.

YOu just have an agenda and are trying to inject insults at every turn.


--
Sandman[.net]
  #226  
Old April 15th 14, 03:28 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Sandman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,467
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Tony Cooper wrote:

nospam:
do you like to do anything *else* other than use
photoshop or lightroom?

using something that makes you more productive means you have
more time to do *other* things.

Tony Cooper:
If your previous method of post-processing left you with no time
to do anything but edit, then you were a) snip trolling


Sandman:
Classic reading comprehension problems and logic fallacy. The
claim of method A resulting in more X than method B does not imply
that method B results in no X what so ever.


Classic trolling where Tony delibrately misinterpretes what nospam
wrote in order to create an argument.


*Create* an argument?


Correct.

The argument was created long before this post.


No, there was no argument about whether or not nospam had no free time or
not, that's the argument you're trying to create here.

While both "create" and "continue" both start with "c", they are
different words.


Very good, Tony. Surprisingly insightful for you.


--
Sandman[.net]
  #227  
Old April 15th 14, 05:12 AM posted to rec.photo.digital
Eric Stevens
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Posts: 13,611
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

On Mon, 14 Apr 2014 22:10:23 -0400, nospam
wrote:

In article , Eric Stevens
wrote:

and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically
there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before.
for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce
the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to
learn how to use it.

Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has
content aware fill.

and a zillion more features.

How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features?

you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if
you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have.


Agreed, but there is a learning time.


it's not as long as you might think.


How long do you think I think?
--

Regards,

Eric Stevens
  #228  
Old April 15th 14, 01:28 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
Sandman
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 5,467
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Tony Cooper wrote:

Sandman:
False logic. If person A usually walks to the store
and person B suggests to use a bicycle to get there faster and
bring back more products, then the veracity of that claim
doesn't hinge on person B providing examples of his own
endevours with a bicycle. He may not even own or need a
bicycle and the claim would still remain true.

Tony Cooper:
What are "endevours" [sic] one does on a bicycle? You might try
"experiences" in that sentence, but I know you'd rather stay
with your rather odd uses of English.


Sandman:
Classic troll tactic - spelling/grammar flame instead of trying to
argue the point.


No, actually it was a word usage flame. I don't care how you
misspell it, I just wonder how one has endeavors on a bicycle.
Unless "Endeavors" is a brand name for chockladbullars. They could
be consumed on a bicycle.


What is chokladbullars [sic], troll?

Tony Cooper:
You're making all about you because - evidently
- it's improved your previously ineffective workflow so you
think everyone else must benefit by doing what you say you
do.

Sandman:
How is this "evident", Tony? nospam has said exactly
nothing about his own experience with Lightroom, or if he
even uses it.

Tony Cooper:
You're the expert at finding previously made statements. You
could find dozens that show that he uses LR.


Sandman:
Class troll misinterpretation - who claimed he didn't use
Lightroom? No one did. You made a claim that it was evident that
Lightroom had improved nospam's supposed inefficient workflow. I
asked you how that is evident, nospam has not told us about any
inefficient workflow and how - if at all - Lightroom has improved
it.


YOu just have an agenda and are trying to inject insults at every
turn.


I will admit, Popinjay, that you have brass balls when it comes to
attempting to duck and weave to avoid being caught out.


Classic troll diversion.

You said: "nospam has said exactly nothing about his own experience
with Lightroom, or if he even uses it".


In response to your specific claim about nospam's workflow. It is your
claim that is being questioned. Classic troll role-reversal.

I provided three cites - gleaned just from the last two days of
posting - where he (Oh, here's your word) substantiates that he does
use LR.


Something that has not been in question. Classic troll diversion.

You did go the sneaky route and snip the cites, and then pirouetted
around to change your statement from "if he even uses it" to "how
Lightroom has improved it". Gina Tse couldn't dance around any
better than that.


Your cite's did not substantiate your original claim, or even the
misinterpretation of my question.

Oh, and he *did* say how LR improved his workflow in one of the
cites you cowardly snipped:


Tony Cooper:
i'm getting the same (or better) results in *far* less time
with lightroom than i ever did with photoshop, and i can
still use photoshop for the occasional images that need
additional work. overall, it's a huge, huge productivity
boost.


You forgot to include a quote of nospam citing HOW it improved his
workflow.

This was not one of your better moments.


Classic role-reversal. And utterly ironic.

Why aren't you just enjoying your vacation? The weather's improved.


I am. Making fun of trolls on usenet is something I have time to do before
we go out or at night when get back.


--
Sandman[.net]
  #229  
Old April 16th 14, 12:32 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

It is not a clone tool. It does not replicate what the clone tool is
capable of. You have to dick around with it to get it to use the area
you want it to use which makes it less effective. Useful for some
things, but not as effective, and certainly not easier to use.


It is not the equal of the PS clone tool, but it is there and when used
judiciously it works. Once you have used it and understand when it
works and when it doesn't, it is reasonably easy to work with. You just
have to understand when you should move to PS as an external editor.
For complex cloning, patching, and where the content aware features
have to come into their own, LR cannot compete. However, for most
editing it does just fine.


Yes, Duck, I tried it a few weeks ago. It's useful, but not the same
as the PS clone tool. They've added some cloning features to the
Healing Brush tool.


they did a helluva lot more than that, and much of the time it's more
useful than what's in photoshop because they also optimized for common
use cases. that's part of how it increases one's productivity.
  #230  
Old April 16th 14, 12:32 PM posted to rec.photo.digital
nospam
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 24,165
Default Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?

In article , Tony Cooper
wrote:

You forgot to include a quote of nospam citing HOW it improved his
workflow.


Ah, but nospam plays it close to the vest. He makes numerous
allusions to the great improvements LR has made in his workflow (which
must have been positively buggywhipish before to improve as much as he
intimates), but he never really gets specific. nospam thinks "*much*"
or "*a lot* or "*far* less time" is description enough. He allegedly
takes photographs and processes them, but that's all that can be
squeezed out of him.


i was very specific and you're about the last person with whom i want
to share any of them.
 




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