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#221
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
On Mon, 14 Apr 2014 08:55:41 -0400, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before. for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to learn how to use it. Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has content aware fill. and a zillion more features. How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features? you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have. Agreed, but there is a learning time. -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#222
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before. for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to learn how to use it. Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has content aware fill. and a zillion more features. How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features? you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have. Agreed, but there is a learning time. it's not as long as you might think. |
#223
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Eric Stevens
wrote: It was old and familiar software, with a few new bells and whistles, riding on a faster horse. In what way is Windows 8 "old and familliar" to a Windows XP user? I will tell you when I get W8. Are you implying that it is so considerably different I will have to start learning about it from the ground up? If it is like that it might be enough to drive me to OSX. win8 is different enough that it has driven a lot of people to osx, however, microsoft is addressing many of the things that people do not like, so you might be ok. |
#224
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Eric Stevens wrote:
Sandman: Imagine that list after someone switched to Lightroom - and all the things they're suddely doing quicker, ey? Eric Stevens: But only after learning how to use light room. Sandman: No, that's calculated in. I.e.even after including the time it takes "learned" Lightroom, you're still ahead in terms of efficiency. I suppose that's true if you process your images while you learn. Nope, even if it's a seperate process. I was thinking of learning first and then processing your target images. As was I: Sandman: For the record - Lightroom is super easy to ue and learn. You can be up and running in five minutes and then learn new things while using it. Eric Stevens: In the examples I quoted (which you snipped) very little new learning was required. Sandman: Sure it was, you spoke about new versions of the operating system, that can require at least as much learning as Lightroom to use to its full extent. The only occasions I can remember where I had to put some effort into learning the operating system was at my first contact with Windows 3 and later with NT4. The progress up the chain to W7 took relatively little efort. Then I guess you haven't upgraded to Windows 8, which would be the contemporary version in this discussion. It requires some heavy duty rethinking in many areas. Eric Stevens: It was old and familiar software, with a few new bells and whistles, riding on a faster horse. Sandman: In what way is Windows 8 "old and familliar" to a Windows XP user? I will tell you when I get W8. Are you implying that it is so considerably different I will have to start learning about it from the ground up? If it is like that it might be enough to drive me to OSX. Windows 8 requires you to learn a whole lot of new things, yes. I won't be comparing it to anything specific, but there's a lot of new stuff and ways to do stuff in W8. -- Sandman[.net] |
#225
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Tony Cooper wrote:
Sandman: False logic. If person A usually walks to the store and person B suggests to use a bicycle to get there faster and bring back more products, then the veracity of that claim doesn't hinge on person B providing examples of his own endevours with a bicycle. He may not even own or need a bicycle and the claim would still remain true. What are "endevours" [sic] one does on a bicycle? You might try "experiences" in that sentence, but I know you'd rather stay with your rather odd uses of English. Classic troll tactic - spelling/grammar flame instead of trying to argue the point. Tony Cooper: You're making all about you because - evidently - it's improved your previously ineffective workflow so you think everyone else must benefit by doing what you say you do. Sandman: How is this "evident", Tony? nospam has said exactly nothing about his own experience with Lightroom, or if he even uses it. You're the expert at finding previously made statements. You could find dozens that show that he uses LR. Class troll misinterpretation - who claimed he didn't use Lightroom? No one did. You made a claim that it was evident that Lightroom had improved nospam's supposed inefficient workflow. I asked you how that is evident, nospam has not told us about any inefficient workflow and how - if at all - Lightroom has improved it. YOu just have an agenda and are trying to inject insults at every turn. -- Sandman[.net] |
#226
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Tony Cooper wrote:
nospam: do you like to do anything *else* other than use photoshop or lightroom? using something that makes you more productive means you have more time to do *other* things. Tony Cooper: If your previous method of post-processing left you with no time to do anything but edit, then you were a) snip trolling Sandman: Classic reading comprehension problems and logic fallacy. The claim of method A resulting in more X than method B does not imply that method B results in no X what so ever. Classic trolling where Tony delibrately misinterpretes what nospam wrote in order to create an argument. *Create* an argument? Correct. The argument was created long before this post. No, there was no argument about whether or not nospam had no free time or not, that's the argument you're trying to create here. While both "create" and "continue" both start with "c", they are different words. Very good, Tony. Surprisingly insightful for you. -- Sandman[.net] |
#227
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
On Mon, 14 Apr 2014 22:10:23 -0400, nospam
wrote: In article , Eric Stevens wrote: and this isn't about learning a new app from scratch either. typically there's a new feature that simplifies what you've been doing before. for instance, content aware fill can in many cases, drastically reduce the amount of time needed to retouch a photo, and it's not that hard to learn how to use it. Yeah. Photoshop and Gimp are the same except that Photoshop has content aware fill. and a zillion more features. How long does it take for you to learn a zillion more features? you don't have to learn every single one of them, but they're there if you need or want any of them, something a gimp user will not have. Agreed, but there is a learning time. it's not as long as you might think. How long do you think I think? -- Regards, Eric Stevens |
#228
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Tony Cooper wrote:
Sandman: False logic. If person A usually walks to the store and person B suggests to use a bicycle to get there faster and bring back more products, then the veracity of that claim doesn't hinge on person B providing examples of his own endevours with a bicycle. He may not even own or need a bicycle and the claim would still remain true. Tony Cooper: What are "endevours" [sic] one does on a bicycle? You might try "experiences" in that sentence, but I know you'd rather stay with your rather odd uses of English. Sandman: Classic troll tactic - spelling/grammar flame instead of trying to argue the point. No, actually it was a word usage flame. I don't care how you misspell it, I just wonder how one has endeavors on a bicycle. Unless "Endeavors" is a brand name for chockladbullars. They could be consumed on a bicycle. What is chokladbullars [sic], troll? Tony Cooper: You're making all about you because - evidently - it's improved your previously ineffective workflow so you think everyone else must benefit by doing what you say you do. Sandman: How is this "evident", Tony? nospam has said exactly nothing about his own experience with Lightroom, or if he even uses it. Tony Cooper: You're the expert at finding previously made statements. You could find dozens that show that he uses LR. Sandman: Class troll misinterpretation - who claimed he didn't use Lightroom? No one did. You made a claim that it was evident that Lightroom had improved nospam's supposed inefficient workflow. I asked you how that is evident, nospam has not told us about any inefficient workflow and how - if at all - Lightroom has improved it. YOu just have an agenda and are trying to inject insults at every turn. I will admit, Popinjay, that you have brass balls when it comes to attempting to duck and weave to avoid being caught out. Classic troll diversion. You said: "nospam has said exactly nothing about his own experience with Lightroom, or if he even uses it". In response to your specific claim about nospam's workflow. It is your claim that is being questioned. Classic troll role-reversal. I provided three cites - gleaned just from the last two days of posting - where he (Oh, here's your word) substantiates that he does use LR. Something that has not been in question. Classic troll diversion. You did go the sneaky route and snip the cites, and then pirouetted around to change your statement from "if he even uses it" to "how Lightroom has improved it". Gina Tse couldn't dance around any better than that. Your cite's did not substantiate your original claim, or even the misinterpretation of my question. Oh, and he *did* say how LR improved his workflow in one of the cites you cowardly snipped: Tony Cooper: i'm getting the same (or better) results in *far* less time with lightroom than i ever did with photoshop, and i can still use photoshop for the occasional images that need additional work. overall, it's a huge, huge productivity boost. You forgot to include a quote of nospam citing HOW it improved his workflow. This was not one of your better moments. Classic role-reversal. And utterly ironic. Why aren't you just enjoying your vacation? The weather's improved. I am. Making fun of trolls on usenet is something I have time to do before we go out or at night when get back. -- Sandman[.net] |
#229
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Tony Cooper
wrote: It is not a clone tool. It does not replicate what the clone tool is capable of. You have to dick around with it to get it to use the area you want it to use which makes it less effective. Useful for some things, but not as effective, and certainly not easier to use. It is not the equal of the PS clone tool, but it is there and when used judiciously it works. Once you have used it and understand when it works and when it doesn't, it is reasonably easy to work with. You just have to understand when you should move to PS as an external editor. For complex cloning, patching, and where the content aware features have to come into their own, LR cannot compete. However, for most editing it does just fine. Yes, Duck, I tried it a few weeks ago. It's useful, but not the same as the PS clone tool. They've added some cloning features to the Healing Brush tool. they did a helluva lot more than that, and much of the time it's more useful than what's in photoshop because they also optimized for common use cases. that's part of how it increases one's productivity. |
#230
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Any Minolta/Sony users using UFRaw and GIMP?
In article , Tony Cooper
wrote: You forgot to include a quote of nospam citing HOW it improved his workflow. Ah, but nospam plays it close to the vest. He makes numerous allusions to the great improvements LR has made in his workflow (which must have been positively buggywhipish before to improve as much as he intimates), but he never really gets specific. nospam thinks "*much*" or "*a lot* or "*far* less time" is description enough. He allegedly takes photographs and processes them, but that's all that can be squeezed out of him. i was very specific and you're about the last person with whom i want to share any of them. |
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