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Is there any camera on earth meeting 4 simple requirements (AA,CF,7x)



 
 
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  #31  
Old June 10th 05, 07:15 PM
Keith Jewell
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Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
Ron wrote:
The propietary batteries I buy on e-Bay for about seven bucks each

Wow. Can you get me a handful of those seven-dollar proprietary
batteries for my Nikon CoolPix 5700 and my JVC DVL-805U camcorder?

I paid upwards of 50 to 75 dollars for MY proprietary batteries.
And, they always go dead within a year or two; so I'm constantly buying
more, typically in an emergency situation where I drive all day in
Germany to find a battery to fit.



A quick eBay search for EN-EL1 turned up hundreds for around $9 with
shipping. They go bad on the shelf, though my experience has been it
takes about two years for that to happen, so you might just buy new
ones once a year. Lenmar's LIJ-408 for your JVC camcorder is a little
rarer, so runs around $30 from many suppliers.

That said, I've personally chosen to standardize on Canon products
which will take a BP-511. I've got two cameras and a video camera now,
so with a dual-bay charger I don't really need to carry much to run
several devices. The batteries have had good life (my nearly four year
old ones are getting about half their original life, newer ones better)
and are common, cheap, and high capacity. I'm done with AA batteries.
The flashlight gets a set of NiMHs that I swap out with the set on the
charger every month regardless of use.

-Keith

  #32  
Old June 10th 05, 07:30 PM
Deep Reset
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"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote in message
oups.com...
MY QUESTION:
Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
- AA batteries
- Good photo quality
- 7x to 10x optical zoom
- CF media

Pentax *ist D with 28-200mm

Deep.


  #33  
Old June 10th 05, 07:39 PM
Out There
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"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:

On the other hand, when I vacation, I carry with me:
- a Nikon CoolPix 5700 (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a JVC video camera (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a Garmin GPS unit (which takes AA batteries)
- a Maglight flashlight (which takes AA batteries)


You can save more space than the extra batteries if you leave the video
camera at home, and replace the GPS unit with a map, a compass, and a
willingness to ask locals for directions.

As far as your 4 requirements for a camera, you can go even simpler by
selecting a camera that does not use batteries, and uses the most common
type of media there is: film. Going to this lower common denominator
means that you can buy lenses with excellent optics, fulfilling your the
other two requirements easily and at a lower cost.
  #34  
Old June 10th 05, 07:47 PM
DFS
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Joseph Meehan wrote:
[Proprietary camera] batteries are not that expensive


I just paid $75 for a camcorder battery (Everready Energizer ER-C620)
for my JVC camcorder and I'm on my fourth or fifth $60 battery for my
Nikon CoolPix 5700 so I just might beg to differ with you on that
point.

-------------------------------------------
Careful shoppers don't pay much (if any) more for proprietary batteries than
for AA rechargeable. Pricegrabber lists sources for your camcorder battery
at $17.95 on up to what you paid. You could have had a battery for the
5700 for $11.95 from SterlingTek.com.

Batteries for the Canon digicams, G series and first generation Rebel are
also now available for less than the price of AA rechargeable. I use an old
Canon G2.I've had the camera and four batteries for three or four years.
Three batteries were cheapies, one the original Canon, packed with the
camera. Canon brand battery is the only one that isn't still holding a full
charge.

Your point on multiple chargers is well taken, though I have a small pouch
that holds them all and gets tossed into the checked bag to avoid carry-on
weight and scrutiny.

DS


  #35  
Old June 10th 05, 08:18 PM
Big Bill
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On 10 Jun 2005 02:18:41 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
wrote:

I agree with you. Consumers Union is sometimes wrong.
That's why I asked this newsgroup.
Because I believe this newsgroup more than I believe Consumer Reports.


You might want to broaden your reading a little beyond CU.
Dpreview, Steve's, even the manufacturers themselves, are all on the
Web, with free professional (biased, on the part of the manufacturers,
possibly, albeit technically correct) reviews of most cameras being
recently marketed.
There's certainly nothing wrong with using newsgroups for this, but,
IMO, restricting yourself to CU for technical reviews of digital
cameras means you are missing a *LOT*.

--
Big Bill
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  #36  
Old June 10th 05, 08:27 PM
Big Bill
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On 10 Jun 2005 09:25:23 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
wrote:

Anthony Matonak wrote:
The limiting factors are AA batteries and Compact Flash.

I was wonderin' why there was only 1 or 3 cameras on earth which
satisfied what I thought was a very simple and universally held set of
4 needs ...


It w3ould seem to be reasonable to think that if they were indeed
"universally held" set of needs, there would be more cameras meeting
them. That there aren't means that either most makers are stupid, or
these aren't really "universally held".
I go for the latter. :-)

it's easy enough to work around memory and batteries ...

I'm sick and tired of proprietary battery packs going bad or forgetting
them or forgetting the charger or carrying them all around or plugging
them in or bringing european adaptors or buying hugely expensive
75-dollar batteries in a rush without being able to shop for price ...


Forgetting the charger will not go away with AAs.
A rush may be an emergency for you, but...
$75 batteries? CU can't show you how to buy something other than OEM?
Adapters for foreign countries will still be required for that AA
charger. And AA chargers still need to be arried around.
And AAs go bad, too.
It would seem that you've not really thought this one through well.

Same thing with the memory cards (although not as vehement ... I
already have the CF PCMCIA adapters (albeit these are inexpensive) in
all my laptops (I never use wires or software to transfer photos to the
laptop hard drive) and I already have a huge investment in 8Mbyte, 32
Mbyte, 128 Mbyte, 256 Mbyte, 512 Mbyte and now 1 Gbyte compact flash
cards (which have served me well over the years for a variety of
electronic needs). I have no desire to change formats just like I don't
switch from the PC to Linux to the MAC (and all that entails) for ever
piece of software I download to edit photos.


No problem. CF is very popular, and will continue to be so.
Although, that "huge" investment in your CF cards below 512 MB is
gone; they are dirt cheap now.

For instance, CF memory isn't any less expensive, or more expensive,
than any other digital camera memory.

I should have made it clear that the only reason for CF is that I chose
CF and it has served me well over the years and I don't want to have to
mix media all over again. Funny ... in a way it's the same as the
battery problem. I wish the manufacturers would just standardize on a
single format and be done with it. Like with PC USB 2.0 compatibility,
if someone wanted a secondary format, they could support BOTH and we'd
all benefit from a little bit of engineering. As stated, CF isn't that
BIG compared to the other formats.

Memory card readers usually read all the popular types of cards
anyhow so compatibility shouldn't be an issue.

I use PCMCIA adapters for the Compact Flash media (all laptops in my
house).
(Yes, I *know* they use proprietary batteries!)
Do they even make a PCMCIA adaptor that handles all card types?

I wouldn't count on disposable AA's for anything except emergency use.

Agreed. I use Ni-MH batteries from CostCo.
I only count on disposable alkaline AAs for emergency use.
That's the fundamental beauty of the AA batteries in the first place!

Susan Henderson


--
Big Bill
Replace "g" with "a"
  #37  
Old June 10th 05, 08:40 PM
Rod Speed
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Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote in message
oups.com...
Rod Speed wrote


Its terminally stupid to be limiting your choices with
that silly requirement that it must use AA batterys.


I think I understand your point about AA batteries.
One the one hand, the battery has nothing to do with the pictures.
So, you are correct. I am an idiot for making AA a requirement.


Basically because it limits your choice of camera so drastically.

On the other hand, when I vacation, I carry with me:
- a Nikon CoolPix 5700 (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a JVC video camera (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a Garmin GPS unit (which takes AA batteries)
- a Maglight flashlight (which takes AA batteries)
etc.


That means I have to carry additional batteries (one or two
are never enough as you well know) and of course I need
to carry separate additional battery chargers and I can't
substitute one for the other and (much worse) I can't stop
at the local A&P to pick up an emergency battery if I need to.


Add the fact that battery packs (by their electrical nature
of positive-minus butt-to-nose abutment) ALWAYS go bad
(one cell reverse polarizes) and, therefore, need to be
constantly replaced at an exhorbitant cost (NiMH cost about
two bucks ... try to get a battery pack for a camera for two bucks).


Sure, its certainly desirable to use standard batterys,
AA or AAA, and I do that when I can, but not when it
limits your choice of model so drastically.

Add to that the waste to the earth's resources (personally
I think the government should mandate single-cell batteries
in all electronics in a save-the-landfill effort like they
mandate the 5 cents per soda waste-return program).


That approach has its own environmental downsides.

And the horrid cost!
Recently I paid over $75 dollars retail for the JVC
replacement battery (the only one in the store was
the Everready Energizer ERC620 camcorder battery).


Now for paying $75 for a stinkin' battery,
you _can_ call me a terminally stupid idiot!


You're likely to be paying at least that much extra when you demand a
camera that takes take single-cell rechargable standard format batteries.

I could have purchased a fifty pound car battery for that much.


Irrelevant.

End result:
I am never again buying any electronics that
does not take single-cell rechargable batteries!


Then you will drastically limit the your
choice with some items like cameras.

I'm sure I'm not the only one so please
come to my defence if you agree,


I dont.

so we can get back to the photographic equipment question at hand.


It makes a lot more sense to just accept
that there are few cameras available that take
single-cell rechargable standard format batteries

Are these really the only three digital cameras on
earth that take single-cell batteries and have decent
picture quality, zoom, and compact flash cards?


Who knows ? Who cares ?

- $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
- $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
- $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?


Surely even you can see that demanding AA batterys would be
costing you more than a spare battery pack with the last two ?


  #38  
Old June 10th 05, 08:44 PM
Rod Speed
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George wrote in message
...
Rod Speed wrote


Its terminally stupid to be limiting your choices with
that silly requirement that it must use AA batterys.


Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote


MY QUESTION:
Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
- AA batteries
- Good photo quality
- 7x to 10x optical zoom
- CF media


I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
requirements:
- AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)


More fool you.


Actually extremely sensible.


Nope, not when it limits the choice of camera to just one camera it isnt.

There is a lot to be said for standard form factor equipment. If the camera
uses a standard form factor battery such as AA you can use NiMh rechargeables
and if you should get in a situation where you deplete the rechargeables and
charging is not available you can easily pop in a set of akaline batterys
which even if you weren't carrying them as a spare can be purchased most
anywhere.


Pity about the dismal choice of camera if you require
it uses AA batterys and that particular media card.

- Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
- 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
- Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)

Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
- Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).

Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.
(Ad copy says it can focus at 4 inches so that seems like a built-in
macro non-macro to me ... what do you think)?

Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?



  #39  
Old June 10th 05, 08:48 PM
Rod Speed
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Ken Burns wrote in message
news
- AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)


That means that you will never again buy electronics.


Thats just plain wrong, some products are tending towards the use
of standard format rechargeable cells, most obviously cordless phones.



  #40  
Old June 10th 05, 08:54 PM
Rod Speed
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Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote in message
oups.com...
Ken Burns wrote


- AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)


That means that you will never again buy electronics.


I understand your point.


In fact, I wish my laptops and cell phones would use standard-size batteries.


There is a good reason why they dont, its too limiting
to the design, particularly with cellphones and cameras.

In double fact, I'll pay MORE for a laptop or
cell phone which used standard-sized batteries.


Yet you objected to the optional battery packs for cameras that allow that.

If we ALL did this,


That isnt going to happen with anything.

the price would go down as we'd have MANY suppliers for batteries,


Thats arguable with enough suppliers of the specialist batterys now.

and we'd be able to re-use our batteries for more than one electronic
device and there would be LOWER COST BETTER EQUIPMENT
ALWAYS USABLE in the end, for all of us, for all our electronics.


Thats never going to happen, for the same reason there
isnt just one format with non rechargable batterys either.

Am I the ONLY one who sees this enchanting possibility of progress?


Its just your pathetic little drug crazed fantasy |-)

There's quite a bit of use of AAA instead of AA format now, and
if you think about it for a moment, there is a good reason for that.



 




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