Wierd edge development on 120 film

Just developed my first roll of 120 and the result has some serious
issues. There are large yellow blotches and most of the negs look kind
of mottled which I guess might before a fix related issue. The edge on
one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them, though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

I've developed around 6 rolls of 35mm with ilfosol-s 1:9 with no
problems at all.

For this film (fp4+ rated at EI50) I used ilford perceptol 1:3 and
agfa agefix for fixer which I have never used before. Their datashet
said to only fix for 30secs which seems very short.

Any ideas what is causing these problems? Good thing I dev'ed an
unimportant roll to test...

Mark

Wierd edge development on 120 film

.. The edge on one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them,
though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

Possible the film was loaded in the bright light. Gets me once in a whil also.

Bob AZ USA

Mark

Wierd edge development on 120 film

.. The edge on one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them,
though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

Possible the film was loaded in the bright light. Gets me once in a whil also.

Bob AZ USA

On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 16:41:10 +0000, RWatson767 wrote:

Wierd edge development on 120 film
The edge on one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them,
though the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

Possible the film was loaded in the bright light.

Yes, that would be my first guess as well, though it is difficult to tell
without seeing them.
120 film isnt the best light sealed thing, nowhere near as good as 35mm,
so if the roll has come slightly loose, it does allow a small amount of
light to creep round the edges when loading.
At least you didnt do what I did a few months ago - I loaded the film the
wrong way round, and only realised when I took the film out.Luckily I was
taking pics of an old cathedral, and still had time to retake the ones I'd
already 'lost'.
Alan.

--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.
http://www.dvatc.co.uk - Off-road cycling in the North Midlands.

On Fri, 22 Oct 2004 16:41:10 +0000, RWatson767 wrote:

Wierd edge development on 120 film
The edge on one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them,
though the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

Possible the film was loaded in the bright light.

Yes, that would be my first guess as well, though it is difficult to tell
without seeing them.
120 film isnt the best light sealed thing, nowhere near as good as 35mm,
so if the roll has come slightly loose, it does allow a small amount of
light to creep round the edges when loading.
At least you didnt do what I did a few months ago - I loaded the film the
wrong way round, and only realised when I took the film out.Luckily I was
taking pics of an old cathedral, and still had time to retake the ones I'd
already 'lost'.
Alan.

--
To reply by e-mail, change the ' + ' to 'plus'.
http://www.dvatc.co.uk - Off-road cycling in the North Midlands.

Mark Liddell wrote:

Just developed my first roll of 120 and the result has some serious
issues. There are large yellow blotches and most of the negs look kind
of mottled which I guess might before a fix related issue. The edge on
one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them, though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

I've developed around 6 rolls of 35mm with ilfosol-s 1:9 with no
problems at all.

For this film (fp4+ rated at EI50) I used ilford perceptol 1:3 and
agfa agefix for fixer which I have never used before. Their datashet
said to only fix for 30secs which seems very short.

Any ideas what is causing these problems? Good thing I dev'ed an
unimportant roll to test...

That 30 second fix time is just nuts. Do a clearing time test, and fix
for at least three times and no more than ten times the clearing time
(which, for most films in rapid fixer at film strength, will normally be
around a minute). You need to refix, and all your problems will be solved.

--
The challenge to the photographer is to command the medium, to use
whatever current equipment and technology furthers his creative
objectives, without sacrificing the ability to make his own decisions.
-- Ansel Adams

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer http://silent1.home.netcom.com

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Mark Liddell wrote:

Just developed my first roll of 120 and the result has some serious
issues. There are large yellow blotches and most of the negs look kind
of mottled which I guess might before a fix related issue. The edge on
one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on them, though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

I've developed around 6 rolls of 35mm with ilfosol-s 1:9 with no
problems at all.

For this film (fp4+ rated at EI50) I used ilford perceptol 1:3 and
agfa agefix for fixer which I have never used before. Their datashet
said to only fix for 30secs which seems very short.

Any ideas what is causing these problems? Good thing I dev'ed an
unimportant roll to test...

That 30 second fix time is just nuts. Do a clearing time test, and fix
for at least three times and no more than ten times the clearing time
(which, for most films in rapid fixer at film strength, will normally be
around a minute). You need to refix, and all your problems will be solved.

--
The challenge to the photographer is to command the medium, to use
whatever current equipment and technology furthers his creative
objectives, without sacrificing the ability to make his own decisions.
-- Ansel Adams

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer http://silent1.home.netcom.com

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Just re-checked the fix time on agfa's site. 6-8 mins not 30secs for
1:7 diluation, I looked at details for the wrong fixer! oops. Doesn't
explain the edges though, but could have been while loading the film
as suggested by you guys.

I'll shoot another roll tomorrow and try again...
--
Mark


That 30 second fix time is just nuts. Do a clearing time test, and fix
for at least three times and no more than ten times the clearing time
(which, for most films in rapid fixer at film strength, will normally be
around a minute). You need to refix, and all your problems will be solved.

--
The challenge to the photographer is to command the medium, to use
whatever current equipment and technology furthers his creative
objectives, without sacrificing the ability to make his own decisions.
-- Ansel Adams

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer http://silent1.home.netcom.com

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

Just re-checked the fix time on agfa's site. 6-8 mins not 30secs for
1:7 diluation, I looked at details for the wrong fixer! oops. Doesn't
explain the edges though, but could have been while loading the film
as suggested by you guys.

I'll shoot another roll tomorrow and try again...
--
Mark


That 30 second fix time is just nuts. Do a clearing time test, and fix
for at least three times and no more than ten times the clearing time
(which, for most films in rapid fixer at film strength, will normally be
around a minute). You need to refix, and all your problems will be solved.

--
The challenge to the photographer is to command the medium, to use
whatever current equipment and technology furthers his creative
objectives, without sacrificing the ability to make his own decisions.
-- Ansel Adams

Donald Qualls, aka The Silent Observer http://silent1.home.netcom.com

Opinions expressed are my own -- take them for what they're worth
and don't expect them to be perfect.

"Donald Qualls" wrote in message
...
Mark Liddell wrote:

Just developed my first roll of 120 and the result has
some serious
issues. There are large yellow blotches and most of the
negs look kind
of mottled which I guess might before a fix related
issue. The edge on
one side of every frame have the same clear pattern on
them, though
the very edge where the frame numbers are on is fine.

I've developed around 6 rolls of 35mm with ilfosol-s 1:9
with no
problems at all.

For this film (fp4+ rated at EI50) I used ilford
perceptol 1:3 and
agfa agefix for fixer which I have never used before.
Their datashet
said to only fix for 30secs which seems very short.

Any ideas what is causing these problems? Good thing I
dev'ed an
unimportant roll to test...

That 30 second fix time is just nuts. Do a clearing time
test, and fix for at least three times and no more than
ten times the clearing time (which, for most films in
rapid fixer at film strength, will normally be around a
minute). You need to refix, and all your problems will be
solved.


HP-4 is a conventional emulsion. It should fix out in twice
the clearing time. Some tabular grain films may need more to
fix out completely but I've not seen any real substantiation
of this. In any case more than three times the clearing time
is unecessary.
For film strength rapid fixer the clearing time for
conventional emulsions should be on the order of one to
three minutes and total fixing time on the order of double
that. I completely agree with maing a clearing test but
advise soaking the test film in water for a couple of
minutes. The reason is that wet film fixes at a different
rate than dry film. Early researchers into the optimum
concentration of thiosulfate ran into this effect. The found
a value of thiosulfate where the fixing time appeared to be
a minimum. Later research showed that this was an effect of
fixing dry film. When wet there was no optimum and fixing
continued to become shorter with increasing concentration.
Also, refix the film, it should clear. Also, treat it in
Kodak Hypo Clearing Agent, as directed, after the refixing.
This may help to remove some fixing reaction products which
are not converted to a soluble form if refixing is not
within about 48 hours of the original fixing process. Wash
as directed on the wash aid package.
Fixing time varies with the emulsion for any type of
fixer. Very slow chloride emulsions, as found in contact
paper like Kodak Azo, fix out very rapidly. Fast film
emulsions, which have a lot of silver iodide in them, fix
out very slowly even in rapid fixer. It may be the high
iodide content of T-Max and Delta films which makes them
slow to fix out.


--
---
Richard Knoppow
Los Angeles, CA, USA