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The Value Of An Apology, At Least From A Republican's Perspective!!



 
 
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  #111  
Old October 8th 09, 11:35 PM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.equipment.35mm
Bill Graham
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Posts: 3,294
Default The Value Of An Apology, At Least From A Republican's Perspective!!


"Neil Harrington" wrote in message
...

"tony cooper" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 5 Oct 2009 13:14:07 +0100, Chris H wrote:




I do understand but having seem FOX news and many others the same
pictures with slightly different words can portray a very different
scene.

I recall during the floods in New Orleans there was a comment that there
were gangs of black criminals looting and white vigilantes trying to
keep the peace and get supplies for people.


I don't believe this either. The meaning of the word "vigilantes"
would be understood by any professional journalist, and not used to
describe "keeping the peace". A description using "vigilantes" would
be as negative as a description using "looters".


Not necessarily. "Vigilantes" implies a group of citizens that "take the
law into their own hands," to use the common phrase. Sometimes that is the
necessary and proper thing to do.

Do you know where and when the term got started?

In the mid-19th century, San Francisco, then a relatively small town, was
much troubled by crime and violence. Honest men and women were attacked
and robbed, businesses were too, streets and homes were unsafe, and the
local judges and peace officers were worse than useless -- basically the
local law was in cahoots with the criminals.

Eventually the local citizens got fed up with this and formed what they
called a "vigilance committee." (This of course is where "vigilante" comes
from.) One day the committee rounded up a number of the most notorious
crooks, including some of the local "law" I believe, gave them a speedy
trial and hanged them.

The effect on San Francisco was salutory. Criminals and corrupt law
officers alike fled the city post haste, and it became (for a while) a
peaceful, law-abiding and orderly town.

As I recollect, the citizens of San Francisco had to do that twice, and on
one occasion federal troops were called in to protect the corrupt local
law, with mixed results.

These very interesting and even instructive events are extensively covered
in the book "The Barbary Coast," by Herbert Asbury, published in 1933 --
about five years after his better known book, "Gangs of New York." The
latter of course was what the silly movie of that title with Leonardo
DiCaprio was supposedly based on -- though to even suggest that there's
any similarity between the book and the movie should be made a criminal
offense. Both books are an excellent read and may still be available -- I
have facsimile reprints of both, haven't read them for many years but must
do so again soon.


In other words gang warfare but the very subtle differences in the words
portrayed one group as criminals and the other as upholding the law


The word "vigilantes" does not mean upholding the law. Vigilantes
operate outside of the law and contrary to the law. Any use of
"vigilante" has negative meaning and negative connotation.


It has that meaning and connotation for you, because of the way it is
generally used and because you presumably don't know how the term
originated.. But when there is no law organization doing the job the law
is supposed to do, and peaceful, honest citizens are being attacked,
robbed and worse -- as obviously was the case in New Orleans -- then the
vigilante in one form or another becomes necessary. What else can people
do to protect themselves? Remember that in New Orleans during Katrina,
many of the police fled the city (two of them stole a police cruiser and
were arrested in Texas) and the mayor fled also. Whatever police remained
seem to have been absolutely useless.


Long before Katrina, the New Orleans Police Department was well known for
its corruption......

  #112  
Old October 9th 09, 01:06 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.equipment.35mm
Tony Cooper
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Posts: 4,748
Default The Value Of An Apology, At Least From A Republican's Perspective!!

On Thu, 8 Oct 2009 15:03:32 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote:


"tony cooper" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:11:41 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote:

I am only wrong in your eyes, Tony. I find that you will seek out some
minor
discrepancy in what I say, and seize on it to make your
point....Savageduck
does this frequently too. I do think in generalities, rather than
specifics,


The devil is in the details. Although, claiming that US unemployment
is at 20% or thinking that "vigilante" is an antonym for "looter" is
hardly a petty detail. You and Bill Graham share a propensity for
bungling the specifics.


I never said either one of those things....The unemployment is currently at
9.8% nationally, although here in Oregon it is closer to 12% A vigilante is
an unlicensed policeman.


I erred, Bill, and I apologize. So much of Chris's comments were in
the post that I thought I was replying to Chris. You did not say
those things. Your bungles have been in other areas. More of your
bungles are in today's posts.

--
Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
  #113  
Old October 9th 09, 01:53 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.equipment.35mm
Bill Graham
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,294
Default The Value Of An Apology, At Least From A Republican's Perspective!!


"tony cooper" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 8 Oct 2009 15:03:32 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote:


"tony cooper" wrote in message
. ..
On Wed, 7 Oct 2009 17:11:41 -0700, "Bill Graham"
wrote:

I am only wrong in your eyes, Tony. I find that you will seek out some
minor
discrepancy in what I say, and seize on it to make your
point....Savageduck
does this frequently too. I do think in generalities, rather than
specifics,

The devil is in the details. Although, claiming that US unemployment
is at 20% or thinking that "vigilante" is an antonym for "looter" is
hardly a petty detail. You and Bill Graham share a propensity for
bungling the specifics.


I never said either one of those things....The unemployment is currently
at
9.8% nationally, although here in Oregon it is closer to 12% A vigilante
is
an unlicensed policeman.


I erred, Bill, and I apologize. So much of Chris's comments were in
the post that I thought I was replying to Chris. You did not say
those things. Your bungles have been in other areas. More of your
bungles are in today's posts.

Look. there are many ways to insult me. But confusing me with Chris is
unpardonable.....:^)

  #114  
Old October 9th 09, 09:41 AM posted to rec.photo.digital.slr-systems,rec.photo.equipment.35mm
Chris H
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Posts: 2,283
Default The Value Of An Apology, At Least From A Republican's Perspective!!

In message , Neil
Harrington writes

"Chris H" wrote in message
...
In message , Bill Graham
writes

"Neil Harrington" wrote in message news:eOudnT2s
...

"Chris H" wrote in message news:Un0zfYCDz1xKFAb
...
In message , Neil
Harrington writes

"DRS" wrote in message
news:UNidnVWBibNWclnXnZ2dnUVZ_gCdnZ2d@westne t.com.au...
"Chris H" wrote in message

In message , DRS
It is also why the US has now followed the UK's lead (and greater
experience) in saying any solution must now involve discussions with
the
Taliban. An "organisation" that has run the US military into the ground
for the last 7 years, as it did the Russians.

And at least two earlier British efforts. But "discussions" with the
Taliban seem a naive and foolish idea, something like having a
discussion about future relationships with a rattlesnake.


Worked before all over the world. Including with the US supported PIAR

When you're dealing with a group that believes cutting off people's
hands, feet, arms or legs are reasonable forms of corrective
punishment for paying insufficient attention to their view of proper
Muslim rectitude, what common ground is there for discussion?


The USA executes people too.... believes in torture and has no problem
wit killing civilians.

Exactly. These people have carried religion to its most ridiculous
extreme.


And of course the Christian right in the US don't?

They believe that their god wants them to kill off every last person on
earth, just to get rid of all the non-Muslims. Why he can't do this all
by himself doesn't seem to occur to their miniscule minds. But in any
case, its them or us, and the sooner we realize this, the better off we
will be.



The religious right in the US is no different to the religious fanatics
anywhere else.


Where in the U.S. do you see religious fanatics cutting people's hands and
feet off for not properly following religious law?


I don't... they do shoot doctors though....


Where in the U.S. do you see religious fanatics gang-raping a girl to punish
her family for some alleged breach of religious or tribal rules?


Many major cites or is gang rape by gangs (or tribes) no known in the
US?


--
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\
\/\/\/\/\ Chris Hills Staffs England /\/\/\/\/
\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/\/



 




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