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#1
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
Paint.NET is arguably the best free screenshot editor on Windows simply
because it does best what you do most when screenshot editing, where Pinta is supposedly its replacement - but I just tested Pinta - and I found it unusable - so I simply ask if you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing? Example of Paint.NET: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/...spaintnet1.jpg Example of Pinta: http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/...spaintnet2.jpg For as long as I can remember, I've been using Paint.NET freeware, despite the .NET requirement, for quick screenshot editing, simply because Paint.NET does the key things you commonly perform on screenshots faster and easier and more intuitively than any other of the free image editors. Paint.NET = https://www.getpaint.net/download.html Pinta = https://pinta-project.com/pintaproject/pinta/releases Many years ago I tried an MIT Pinta beta, where Pinta was supposedly the Microsoft-funded replacement for Paint.NET, but the version I tried didn't even have curved arrows, so I summarily dropped the endeavor. However, recently I re-installed Windows on a new HDD so I decided to try the latest Microsoft-funded MIT Pinta 1.6, which is supposedly the released version of the successor to Paint.NET 4.0.21. After a quick test, I concluded Pinta is (still) worthless, when compared to Paint.NET for screenshot editing because Pinta (still) doesn't do the most important common elements in screenshot editing that Paint.NET does well. POSITIONAL TEXTING: Pinta is unable to drag text after you type it, which is just untenable in a screenshot editor, whereas Paint.NET adds text intuitively, without need for pre-defind bounding boxes and where you can intuitively change the font, perhaps change the size and the indentation (which Pinta does also), and then you can drag the just-typed text to its final location (which, inexplicably, you can't do in Pinta). CURVED ARROWING: Curved arrowing is a critical feature for screenshot editing, which Paint.NET does better and easier than any other known screenshot editor on this planet (IMHO), but Pinta's curved-arrow GUI, although similar, is both more powerful and yet, far more cumbersome than was Paint.NET ... so that's a wash. OPEN SHAPES: Drawing and then subsequently modifying open shapes such as circles, rectangles, elipses, etc., on the fly is a common screenshot-editing need, where both Paint.NET and Pinta are more intuitive and fewer steps than most screenshot editors, but Pinta, while having more powerful editing-after-the-fact stretch handles, lost the ability to move the final location of the drawn rectangle by not having a movable anchor, so that's a loss for Pinta. PASTE STRETCHING: Pinta is unable to stretch selections, and, it puts copied selections in completely arbitrary locations when pasting them, where with Paint.NET, you select an area, control+c, control+v, and the selection is exactly where you want it, and you get intuitive stretch handles to stretch the pasted selection (which Pinta is completely unable to do) ... so that flaw alone basically kills Pinta as a useful screenshot editor. Given that Pinta doesn't (seem to) do the three most important things needed for a screenshot editor, I simply ask others if they see any reason for Pinta to be used at this stage of its development? -- NOTE: If you know of any freeware screenshot editor that does ALL those key requirements more intuitively than does Paint.NET, I'm all ears, as I hate having to use .NET Framework just to get a decent screenshot editor. |
#2
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NETscreenshot-editing?
On 22/02/2018 04:32, ultred ragnusen wrote:
Pai Can you just **** off and stop spamming Windows 10 newsgroup. -- With over 600 million devices now running Windows 10, customer satisfaction is higher than any previous version of windows. |
#3
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
Good Guy wrote:
Can you just **** off and stop spamming Windows 10 newsgroup. Pot, kettle, black. Besides, it'e a relevant question and observation, with appropriate links and well-annotated example screenshots. |
#4
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
"ultred ragnusen" wrote
| Good Guy wrote: | | Besides, it'e a relevant question and observation, with appropriate links | and well-annotated example screenshots. Just filter out "Good Guy". There's no reason anyone should have to see his posts. By answering him you share his mean-spirited, irrelevant posts with those of us who wouldn't normally see them at all. I realize you don't personally care about .Net, but since you're cross-posting to photo and freeware groups, it's worth noting that Paint.Net always requires the very latest .Net framework, which can be an enormous hog of space if you don't have anything else that needs it. (There's very little popular software that does use .Net.) I downloaded Pinta out of curiosity. The installer tried to go online to download .Net4, without asking me. Then it popped up a message that there were "errors" and it had to quit. No explanation! Only the install log told me it was trying to install .Net4, and only my firewall told me it was trying to go online. So add faulty installer to your negative assessment. I've never tried Paint.Net because of the .Net requirement, but also because for anyone who wants a full-fledged graphic editor there are plenty of other options. Paint Shop Pro 5 is online for free. The latest version of PSP was about $50 last I checked. There's GIMP if you absolutely won't spend money for software. Though the category of "screenshot software" seems to be unique. I've never had a desire to draw a curved arrow on anything, but I can see how that would be helpful if you were doing something like posting images on a website regularly. |
#5
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
Mayayana wrote:
I realize you don't personally care about .Net, but since you're cross-posting to photo and freeware groups, it's worth noting that Paint.Net always requires the very latest .Net framework, which can be an enormous hog of space if you don't have anything else that needs it. (There's very little popular software that does use .Net.) Hi Mayayana, I agree with you that it's terrible that Paint.NET requires the abominable ..NET Framework, where, since this is a newly installed HDD, I watched what the Paint.NET installer installed, and what Pinta installed, which is: - Paint.NET - installed .NET Framework 4.7.1 - Pinta - .NET framework 2.12.22 & GtkSharp 2.12 (whatever that is) What's odd is that both were installed on the same day this week, where one installs a vastly different version of .NET Framework than the other. My main question, since we all hate .NET Framework, is why don't /other/ freeware editors do the /simplest/ of things well? Why is it only Paint.NET that can get texting, bounding boxes, arrowing, and stretch selections right? The split second someone tells me of software that does those 4 things right (as long as it doesn't do the other easy stuff terribly), I'll ditch Paint.NET. I swear! 1. Add text simply without need for bounding boxes & modify easily (e.g., change the size, font, etc., and location in the same steps). 2. Add an "open" bounding box shape that, like the text above, is modifiable on the fly as you're editing, using anchors for position and stretch points for shape. 3. Add an arrow that can curve around objects in the screenshot, and, as in the above, has colors, thicknesses, dashes, arrows, and anchor points that can be moved on the fly at the time of drawing the arrow. 4. Copy and paste a selection on a screenshot that pastes EXACTLY where you copied it from (which is a requirement that is mandatory) so that you can then stretch the edges to cover up extraneous clutter inevitable in any screenshot, along with an anchor to move the pasted object if you so wish. I ask only for a screenshot freeware editor that can do, at least, those four things as easily and as intuitively as does Paint.NET, but I've searched for decades (it seems) and found none. Even Pinta, which is intended to be a modern copy of Paint.NET, fails on all four of those requirements. I downloaded Pinta out of curiosity. The installer tried to go online to download .Net4, without asking me. Yup. See above. Both Paint.NET and Pinta are Microsoft funded, where we all suspect the entire goal is to put out a .NET Framework application that people will use (despite the fact we hate that .NET crap). The funny thing is that the old Paint.NET apparently uses a /newer/ .NET framework, if the number system means anything sequential. Then it popped up a message that there were "errors" and it had to quit. No explanation! Only the install log told me it was trying to install .Net4, and only my firewall told me it was trying to go online. So add faulty installer to your negative assessment. I agree with you wholeheartedly that if we could get rid of these Microsoft-funded freeware apps, we would. But I can't find, in decades (it seems) of looking, a better app for screenshot editing, with respect to the four fundamentals I've described above. Sadly, it seems only the MIT students who designed Paint.NET actually /understood/ screenshot editing usability! I've never tried Paint.Net because of the .Net requirement, but also because for anyone who wants a full-fledged graphic editor there are plenty of other options. No! Emphatically no! I'm not going to claim to be an expert on all picture editing freeware, but if you've ever tried to draw an open bounding box in The GIMP, you'll see how terrible that GUI is compared to Paint.NET. If you've ever tried to move and modify a selection in Irfanview, you'll see how horrid Irfanview is at editing screenshots. If you've ever tried to draw a curved arrow in ANY freeware editor other than Paint.NET, you'll see, instantly, that only the Paint.NET MIT developer knew how to do such simple things. Please don't think I love only Paint.NET because I /hate/ .NET Framework. I love Paint.NET because it does those four things the way they /should/ be done, where it's astounding to me how difficult, in comparison, to do all four in other programs. Bear in mind, other programs do one or the other (especially texting) well, but none do all four, where all four are a requirement in almost all screenshot edits. Paint Shop Pro 5 is online for free. The latest version of PSP was about $50 last I checked. Mayayana, I realize you're a coder and you're intelligent and that you know software - but just listing a bunch of software isn't going to help anyone because I've tried - for decades (it seems) to find something /better/ than Paint.NET (because I hate .NET Framework). Nobody should suggest any other freeware editor until they've /tried/ those four things in Paint.NET that I posit are (a) done right and (b) needed in almost all my screenshot edits. There's GIMP if you absolutely won't spend money for software. See above. Just try to draw an open bounding box in The GIMP and you'll see the hell it puts you through for something that is trivially simple to do in Paint.NET. Though the category of "screenshot software" seems to be unique. Yours is a viable observation, which I appreciate. I use those words specifically because I'm an old hand at this type of editing where you don't usually need to draw bounding boxes, add text, connect them with arrows, and cover selection areas with "photo editors". Editing screenshots is completely different than editing photos, where the similarities are enormous, I agree - but so are the innate differences. I've never had a desire to draw a curved arrow on anything, but I can see how that would be helpful if you were doing something like posting images on a website regularly. The curvature of the arrow is so that you can follow the basic philosophy of your edits not obscuring the inherent data of the screenshot. You can draw straight arrows - but you often connect text to bounding boxes where the text has to go on an empty space on the screenshot as does the arrow. Of course, if you spend HOURS upon HOURS creating the initial screenshot, you can likely organize the initial screenshot such that there is space for the text and arrow that doesn't block the underlying images, but we're talking basics here. If I snap a screenshot of this note, for example, and I want to arrow and text and put a box around your comments, the ability to curve the arrows is essential for efficiency. http://wetakepic.com/images/2018/02/22/screenshots.jpg |
#6
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
"ultred ragnusen" wrote
| My main question, since we all hate .NET Framework, is why don't /other/ | freeware editors do the /simplest/ of things well? Why is it only Paint.NET | that can get texting, bounding boxes, arrowing, and stretch selections | right? | It might be partly due to the same reason that you can get free samples of cheese and crackers at the supermarket, but you rarely see free lobster roll samples.... You're only willing to look at free so you're reducing your options. Any decent graphic editor gives you floating text. I don't know about arrows, as I've never needed them. You're looking for a very specific tool but what you're looking at is graphic editors. As far as .Net goes: My understanding is that Paint.Net was originally designed by a student as a demo of what .Net can do in terms of graphics. The same things require more work when written as native software. .Net is a wrapper around the more abstruse Windows API. Processed food is a pretty good analogy. The other day I got some shrimp on sale and looked online for a new shrimp recipe idea. Shrimp alfredo... That looked interesting. What's the recipe?..... 1 lb. shrimp, a bottle alfredo sauce.... That story is true. That was the recipe! It's easy to make shrimp alfredo if you're just dumping a bottle into a pan. That's why good restaurants have 15 items on the menu and bad restaurants have 150. The latter only need to take something out of the freezer and microwave it. | Paint Shop Pro 5 is online for free. The latest | version of PSP was about $50 last I checked. | | Mayayana, I realize you're a coder and you're intelligent and that you know | software - but just listing a bunch of software isn't going to help anyone | because I've tried - for decades (it seems) to find something /better/ than | Paint.NET (because I hate .NET Framework). | I'm not answering only for you. There are options for graphic editors that are cheap or free. Not everyone wants to draw arrows. Since this is a public discussion it's a good chance to let people know about options. At the same time, since PSP5 is free, even you might find it worth exploring.... even if not for arrow drawing. | I use those words specifically because I'm an old hand at this type of | editing where you don't usually need to draw bounding boxes, add text, | connect them with arrows, and cover selection areas with "photo editors". | I've seen people talk about drawing arrows in the photo group. Maybe the best approach, since you have very specific needs, would be to ask in the photo and graphics groups for exactly the 4 things you want. But it sounds to me like an odd question. In effect you're saying that Paint.Net is exactly what you want, and you want to replace it. Not only that, but the replacement must be free. Something about gift horses comes to mind. |
#7
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
In article , Mayayana
wrote: It might be partly due to the same reason that you can get free samples of cheese and crackers at the supermarket, but you rarely see free lobster roll samples.... You're only willing to look at free so you're reducing your options. you're going to the wrong markets. Processed food is a pretty good analogy. The other day I got some shrimp on sale and looked online for a new shrimp recipe idea. Shrimp alfredo... That looked interesting. What's the recipe?..... 1 lb. shrimp, a bottle alfredo sauce.... That story is true. That was the recipe! at least it's something you could manage. It's easy to make shrimp alfredo if you're just dumping a bottle into a pan. That's why good restaurants have 15 items on the menu and bad restaurants have 150. The latter only need to take something out of the freezer and microwave it. the best restaurants don't have a menu. |
#8
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
Mayayana wrote:
It might be partly due to the same reason that you can get free samples of cheese and crackers at the supermarket, but you rarely see free lobster roll samples.... You're only willing to look at free so you're reducing your options. I don't think that statement is even close to true simply because of obvious factors such as the mere fact that most payware editors won't be "screenshot" editors - so they won't have optimized the screenshoting needs of (a) texting (b) arrowing (c) bounding boxes, and (d) pasted selection stretching as well as has Paint.NET. Remember, a "photo" editor will have completely different basic needs than a "screenshot" editor, where there are fewer payware screenshot editors, so your statement likely doesn't hold water, unless you can find a screenshot editor payware that does those four things as well as does Paint.NET. Any decent graphic editor gives you floating text. You need all four things, where "floating text" is the easiest and many programs have it (and many don't), but if you pick just one thing it's like you telling me that a one-legged race horse can win the race. I don't know about arrows, as I've never needed them. You're looking for a very specific tool but what you're looking at is graphic editors. They're all graphic editors but when you edit screenshots off a computer screen, you need a different set of features than you need when you edit photos taken from a camera. Four features you need which are badly done with most graphic editors are a. texting where you just type it, modify it, and move it. b. bounding boxes where you just draw it, modify it, and move it. c. arrowing where you just draw it, modify it, and move it. d. pasted selections which go back EXACTLY where they came from (which is critical), and which can be stretched and moved as needed. It's amazing how few graphic editors make those tasks as simple as Paint.NET does, where I posit that ZERO graphic editors do all four as easily and intuitively as does Paint.NET. Mind you, I would LOVE to replace paint.net (which is why I tried Pinta again); but those four features are critical, where no other known graphic editor does all four as well. As far as .Net goes: My understanding is that Paint.Net was originally designed by a student as a demo of what .Net can do in terms of graphics. I think Microsoft funded the project, and I think it was at MIT. The same things require more work when written as native software. .Net is a wrapper around the more abstruse Windows API. Yes. Understood. Processed food is a pretty good analogy. The other day I got some shrimp on sale and looked online for a new shrimp recipe idea. Shrimp alfredo... That looked interesting. What's the recipe?..... 1 lb. shrimp, a bottle alfredo sauce.... That story is true. That was the recipe! Good analogy. I'm not answering only for you. Good! I answer for everyone also, which is why you'll see me provide details that most people would skip. I also try to include a ng that is archived by Google so that the tribal knowledge can be accessed in the future. http://tinyurl.com/alt-comp-freeware http://tinyurl.com/rec-photo-digital (unfortunately the Win10 ng is not archived) There are options for graphic editors that are cheap or free. Not one free or payware graphics editor that I know of does the four basics for screenshot editors as well as Paint.NET (and Lord knows, I hate Paint.NET but I'm only looking at the functionality). If there was an editor that did those four things as well as does Paint.NET, I'd have known about it by now I would think since I've asked the same question for decades (it seems). Not everyone wants to draw arrows. Since this is a public discussion it's a good chance to let people know about options. At the same time, since PSP5 is free, even you might find it worth exploring.... even if not for arrow drawing. I have installed scores of graphics editors over the years, including PSP when it was freely available. I didn't find it any better for screenshot editing than Paint.NET was, where I was hoping Pinta would have gotten things right by now. | I use those words specifically because I'm an old hand at this type of | editing where you don't usually need to draw bounding boxes, add text, | connect them with arrows, and cover selection areas with "photo editors". I've seen people talk about drawing arrows in the photo group. I've asked in the past, probably once a year over the past fifteen years, and nothing ever suggested works. On the Mac they are even less knowledgeable than on Windows because all they seem to know on the Mac is Adobe payware stuff. You 'can' draw curved arrows, for example, on the mac, using the default free editors - but they suck like you can't believe. (Try it.) Maybe the best approach, since you have very specific needs, would be to ask in the photo and graphics groups for exactly the 4 things you want. Um, this is a photo and graphics ng. And besides, stop saying it's a 'very specific' need to text, bound, select, and arrow. They are very /basic/ needs. Very common. Very basic. If you think those four tasks are complex needs, then you have completely missed the point because they're as basic a need as it gets for a graphics editor. Bear in mind things like "cropping" and "resizing" and "canvas additions" and "layer imports" and "color changes" are also basic needs, but almost all graphics editors get those basic needs right. I'm only bringing up the four basic things that most (if not almost all) graphics editors get wrong. If you've never used Paint.NET, then you will have utterly no comprehension of what I'm talking about. It's like the difference between driving a Yugo and driving a Corvette. But it sounds to me like an odd question. In effect you're saying that Paint.Net is exactly what you want, and you want to replace it. Not only that, but the replacement must be free. Something about gift horses comes to mind. No no no no. I'm simply asking if anyone else has had the same observation that Pinta isn't ready for prime time because it doesn't even do the basics well. I'm also saying that I hate that Paint.NET uses Net Framework, but it's a necessary evil because nothing out there does screenshot editing well, and particularly I point out 4 very specific things that are done weell on Paint.NET. Your statement is wrong because you think I'm enamored only by HOW they're done, where I agree, texting in, say Irfanview is an abomination compared to Paint.NET and drawing open bounding boxes in The GIMP is an abomination compared to how Paint.NET does it. So those examples show that the HOW is important, since the HOW must be simple, quick, and intuitive. But it's also the CAN that I'm looking at, in that a program that can't paste a selection EXACTLY on top of where it came from, simply introduces error and extra steps for no advantage whatsoever. Just try this in any grapics editor and then try it in Paint.NET. 1. Select an area of any desired shape and size 2. Control + c to copy it and control + v to paste it 3. If the resulting copy isn't EXACTLY on top of the original, it's useless. That's a simple test of efficient functionality. Another simple test of efficient functionality is: 1. Start texting an area (just start typing) 2. Then modify that text (e.g., add line indents, change words, fonts). 3. Then move the text to a desired location and edit it some more If the graphics editor can't do something as simple as that, it's useless. Again, remember I hate Paint.NET's need for .NET Framework, but I have looked for decades (it seems) for a better more functionally intuitive graphics editor for the dozen or so basic steps, where those 4 steps, in particular, are done better on Paint.NET than any other graphics editor known. If you don't understand that statement, you have to try those four things. |
#9
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
In article , ultred
ragnusen wrote: You 'can' draw curved arrows, for example, on the mac, using the default free editors - but they suck like you can't believe. (Try it.) nonsense. *no* additional software is needed on a mac to take and edit screen shots, including adding arrows, text or whatever else. none. you've even been told how to do it, which you of course ignore, as you do with everything that doesn't fit your ****ed up view of the world. |
#10
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Do you see any advantage of Pinta freeware over Paint.NET screenshot-editing?
nospam wrote:
You 'can' draw curved arrows, for example, on the mac, using the default free editors - but they suck like you can't believe. (Try it.) nonsense. You must have bought too many arguments this week because you say nonsense above and then you agree below. *no* additional software is needed on a mac to take and edit screen shots, including adding arrows, text or whatever else. none. Nobody said additional software was needed. you've even been told how to do it, which you of course ignore, as you do with everything that doesn't fit your ****ed up view of the world. I know full well how to do it, and I wrote at the time and explained at the time how atrocious it was, but I agreed at the time that it could be done. So you must have simply bought too many arguments this week. |
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