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Pyro Staining B&W negatives vs. C-41 Monochromatic film
What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to
C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. What are you trying to accomplish? -- --- Richard Knoppow Los Angeles, CA, USA |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message
news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. You are really talking about apples and swimming pools here. What are you envisioning as your final prints, Azo or an alt process contact print, or machine enlargment prints? Can you even get C-41 B&W films big enough for a decent contact print? If you are planning on doing enlargments, ABC is nearly useless. Look at PMK or Pyrocat HD for that, and you will get much "sharper" negs that you would with the C-41 stuff. Brook |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message
news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. You are really talking about apples and swimming pools here. What are you envisioning as your final prints, Azo or an alt process contact print, or machine enlargment prints? Can you even get C-41 B&W films big enough for a decent contact print? If you are planning on doing enlargments, ABC is nearly useless. Look at PMK or Pyrocat HD for that, and you will get much "sharper" negs that you would with the C-41 stuff. Brook |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message
news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. You are really talking about apples and swimming pools here. What are you envisioning as your final prints, Azo or an alt process contact print, or machine enlargment prints? Can you even get C-41 B&W films big enough for a decent contact print? If you are planning on doing enlargments, ABC is nearly useless. Look at PMK or Pyrocat HD for that, and you will get much "sharper" negs that you would with the C-41 stuff. Brook |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no...
What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. ABC is a very old formula, and I doubt you will have very good results with modern films. Pyro is highly toxic and tricky to work with. It's hard to control the staining, as stop baths and fixers will bleach it out depending on various conditions. Pyro today has very little to recommend it. |
"KS" not.me@com wrote in message news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no...
What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. ABC is a very old formula, and I doubt you will have very good results with modern films. Pyro is highly toxic and tricky to work with. It's hard to control the staining, as stop baths and fixers will bleach it out depending on various conditions. Pyro today has very little to recommend it. |
"Michael Scarpitti" wrote in message om... "KS" not.me@com wrote in message news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. ABC is a very old formula, and I doubt you will have very good results with modern films. Pyro is highly toxic and tricky to work with. It's hard to control the staining, as stop baths and fixers will bleach it out depending on various conditions. Pyro today has very little to recommend it. It's utterly amazing how little you really know Mike. The only thing you got right was it's an old formula, but then again, so is Rodinal... Pyro in all of it's formulations works fine with most modern emulsion films. ABC pryo inclusive. Due to it's staining characteristics negatives developed in Pyro print exceptionally well with variable contrast papers. Using an alkaline fixer formula (TF-3 or TF-4), and a water bath between dev and fix and staining can be controlled very well. A post fixer bath of an alkaline solution enhances the stain formation. Since the developer is a one shot process and alkaline in pH, most use the spent developer for this bath. You do it with the lights on so you can control the staining. While toxic, it's no more toxic than many normal household products, with the exception that it's easily absorbed through the skin. So gloves and dust mask are a necessity. MSDS shows the LD 50 in rats to be 789 mg to 1 kg body weight. On the other hand, a dog only needs 25 mg per kg. I would recommend Gordon Hutchings PMK formula (Pyro/Metol/Kodalk) and his _The Book of Pyro_ available from the Photographers Formulary and other sources. Pyro negatives and prints have an increase in tonality, sharpness, acutance and separations in the highlights. This is most noticeable in MF and LF prints, but it is also usable with 35mm. Another advantage is the stain tends to mask the grain. This may be a benefit for 35mm by itself. You'll only know if it fit's into your needs if you try it. Plus-X and Tri-X seem to work well with the advantage going to Tri-X. So don't let those who have never tried Pyro steer you the wrong way. Jim |
"Michael Scarpitti" wrote in message om... "KS" not.me@com wrote in message news:WifTc.97257$M95.43550@pd7tw1no... What are the advantages/differences between using say ABC Pyro as opposed to C-41 based B&W process film? I'm debating whether it is worth the trouble to use play around with pyro. Thx. ABC is a very old formula, and I doubt you will have very good results with modern films. Pyro is highly toxic and tricky to work with. It's hard to control the staining, as stop baths and fixers will bleach it out depending on various conditions. Pyro today has very little to recommend it. It's utterly amazing how little you really know Mike. The only thing you got right was it's an old formula, but then again, so is Rodinal... Pyro in all of it's formulations works fine with most modern emulsion films. ABC pryo inclusive. Due to it's staining characteristics negatives developed in Pyro print exceptionally well with variable contrast papers. Using an alkaline fixer formula (TF-3 or TF-4), and a water bath between dev and fix and staining can be controlled very well. A post fixer bath of an alkaline solution enhances the stain formation. Since the developer is a one shot process and alkaline in pH, most use the spent developer for this bath. You do it with the lights on so you can control the staining. While toxic, it's no more toxic than many normal household products, with the exception that it's easily absorbed through the skin. So gloves and dust mask are a necessity. MSDS shows the LD 50 in rats to be 789 mg to 1 kg body weight. On the other hand, a dog only needs 25 mg per kg. I would recommend Gordon Hutchings PMK formula (Pyro/Metol/Kodalk) and his _The Book of Pyro_ available from the Photographers Formulary and other sources. Pyro negatives and prints have an increase in tonality, sharpness, acutance and separations in the highlights. This is most noticeable in MF and LF prints, but it is also usable with 35mm. Another advantage is the stain tends to mask the grain. This may be a benefit for 35mm by itself. You'll only know if it fit's into your needs if you try it. Plus-X and Tri-X seem to work well with the advantage going to Tri-X. So don't let those who have never tried Pyro steer you the wrong way. Jim |
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