Camera drones
 

I might get a camera drone mainly for still photography. Is anybody
using these and what are your experiences?

Generally speaking it seems that (unless you want to spend several
thousands of Euro or $) the sensor sizes are relatively small (1" and
1/2.3" sensors), but that could suffice if you shoot at low ISO levels.

Aside from the cost, portability also matters, because I would bring the
usual camera gear + the drone on my trips.
--
Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
https://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
https://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site

Camera drones
 

In article ,
RichA wrote:

I might get a camera drone mainly for still photography. Is anybody
using these and what are your experiences?


....

Most of the cheap ones have limited flight time. I'd also like to know
how reliable video links are with them.

the cheap ones don't do fpv so there's no link to worry about, and they
also require knowing how to fly it, so plan on damaging and/or losing
it until you get good at it.

tl;dr you get what you pay for.

Camera drones
 

On 2018-11-20 14:02, Alfred Molon wrote:
I might get a camera drone mainly for still photography. Is anybody
using these and what are your experiences?

Generally speaking it seems that (unless you want to spend several
thousands of Euro or $) the sensor sizes are relatively small (1" and
1/2.3" sensors), but that could suffice if you shoot at low ISO levels.

Aside from the cost, portability also matters, because I would bring the
usual camera gear + the drone on my trips.


The latest Mavic Pro from DJI has a Hasselblad designed camera as an
option... otherwise the basic camera is more-or-less a good 12 Mpix with
some exposure options (speed, iso).

You could probably find a used Phantom 4 Pro. Very good camera for both
video and stills ("1" sensor). Flight times close to 30 minutes.

The Mavic Pro is better for travel as it folds up quite neatly. Good
flight time (24+ minutes, later versions a slight bit better). In
reality you would fly about 15 - 20 minutes due to safety margins.
There are cheaper options (Mavic "fly") for example - less flight time.

Be careful where you travel. Some destinations may seize the drone on
entry and demand a huge fee to get it back when you leave. Often people
never see their drones again...

I believe you're in Germany? If so, you will need civil liability
insurance and fireproof identification plates affixed to your drone to
fly there. You need to learn the law wherever you fly. (max heights,
exclusion zones, rules over populated areas, etc.)

I own both the original Mavic Pro and the Phantom 4 Pro. Both are very
good - each has its advantages and limitations. Both are very easy to
control (basically are always on autopilot).

That said, a lot of the photography with drones with so called 1"
sensors is stunningly good. (Phantom 4 Pro). Even the Mavic Pro with a
cell phone class sensor (though better lens) can be very good in the
right circumstances.

The real thrill of this, however, is making nice videos.

The real pain of that, however, is video editing, which is 100x more
painful than still editing with a long learning curve.

--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester

Camera drones
 

In article , Alan Browne
says...


The latest Mavic Pro from DJI has a Hasselblad designed camera as an
option... otherwise the basic camera is more-or-less a good 12 Mpix with
some exposure options (speed, iso).

You could probably find a used Phantom 4 Pro. Very good camera for both
video and stills ("1" sensor). Flight times close to 30 minutes.

The Mavic Pro is better for travel as it folds up quite neatly. Good
flight time (24+ minutes, later versions a slight bit better). In
reality you would fly about 15 - 20 minutes due to safety margins.
There are cheaper options (Mavic "fly") for example - less flight time.

Be careful where you travel. Some destinations may seize the drone on
entry and demand a huge fee to get it back when you leave. Often people
never see their drones again...

I believe you're in Germany? If so, you will need civil liability
insurance and fireproof identification plates affixed to your drone to
fly there. You need to learn the law wherever you fly. (max heights,
exclusion zones, rules over populated areas, etc.)

I own both the original Mavic Pro and the Phantom 4 Pro. Both are very
good - each has its advantages and limitations. Both are very easy to
control (basically are always on autopilot).

That said, a lot of the photography with drones with so called 1"
sensors is stunningly good. (Phantom 4 Pro). Even the Mavic Pro with a
cell phone class sensor (though better lens) can be very good in the
right circumstances.

The real thrill of this, however, is making nice videos.

The real pain of that, however, is video editing, which is 100x more
painful than still editing with a long learning curve.

Thanks for the interesting feedback. I did some more research in the
meantime, and discovered that there are lots of restrictions on using
the drones in many places.

For instance I'm travelling to Algeria at the end of the year, but it
seems impossible for a foreigner to get a flight permit in Algeria.
Which is too bad, because Algeria should have some wildly photogenic
places (especially if you can use a drone).

Then I just checked this map of German flight exclusion zones:
https://map2fly.flynex.de/

Unless I got something wrong, the whole of Munich seems to be a no fly
zone. Also here I was thinking of getting some nice skyline shots with
the Frauenkirche and alps background, but if indeed it's prohibited,
well...

The liability insurance is not a big deal (you can get one for around 30
Euro/year). The aluminium is also not a big deal.

The Mavic 2 Pro is the most likely candidate, but I must say it's still
quite expensive (around 1400 Euro here in Germany).
The only thing which scares me a bit, if this thing has any technical
glitch and falls on the ground from an altitude of 100 metres, it
probably smashes into little pieces and you lose the 1400 Euro you spent
on it. Are these drones reliable, i.e. they won't just fall from the
sky?

Portability for the Mavic 2 Pro seems great, the biggest issue however
are all these restrictions on the use of the drones.
--
Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
https://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
https://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site

Camera drones
 

On 2018-11-24 10:42, Alfred Molon wrote:

The Mavic 2 Pro is the most likely candidate, but I must say it's still
quite expensive (around 1400 Euro here in Germany).
The only thing which scares me a bit, if this thing has any technical
glitch and falls on the ground from an altitude of 100 metres, it
probably smashes into little pieces and you lose the 1400 Euro you spent
on it. Are these drones reliable, i.e. they won't just fall from the
sky?

DJI drones are extremely reliable with "drop out of the sky" issues
quite rare. Where Mavic Pro's are concerned, such incidents are most
likely failure to ensure the battery is latched into place.

The main concern is, no matter how reliable they are, you never fly over
people or property that could get damaged.

Recently on another DJI model, there have been other incidents and DJI
have issued safety warnings (and possible firmware updates - I haven't
been following it closely). IAC, the drone, on very low battery will
attempt to land immediately.

When you buy DJI drones, esp. if you are new to the thing, it is
probably best to purchase "DJI Care Refresh" which allows total loss
replacement up to 2 times within 1 year - whether or not it is your
fault (a "fee" each time). In fact they even offered to sell me an
additional year, though I didn't take them up on it.

Sole "catch" is you must return the crashed drone. So if you dump it in
a lake or ocean or simply cannot find it, then that does not apply.



Portability for the Mavic 2 Pro seems great, the biggest issue however
are all these restrictions on the use of the drones.

Indeed. As Canadian rule makers have gone insane, I've used my drones
very little over the past year. Indeed only for a scuba trip to Roatan
and to make a survey of a friend's property.

I'd suggest you find locals who have drones and talk with them about it.

If you buy a Mavic, I suggest you get at least 1 extra battery (or 2
more). "Fly more kit".

Another model to consider is the "Spark". Good enough camera.

With the original MP, the "Fly more" had 2 additional batteries. With
the M2, the "Fly more" appears to have only 1 more battery. Batteries
are expensive. Very.

These drones are very rich in features - from automatic return in case
of signal loss or other conditions to maneuver sequences and much more.
It takes a lot of time to learn them all - and it is critical that the
safety setups be done correctly for different situations.

Also, while the OS in the drones is Linux, DJI drones always seem to
work best with the user's phone or pad being iOS (Apple).

--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester

Camera drones
 

On Nov 24, 2018, Alfred Molon wrote
(in . com):

In , Alan Browne
says...


The latest Mavic Pro from DJI has a Hasselblad designed camera as an
option... otherwise the basic camera is more-or-less a good 12 Mpix with
some exposure options (speed, iso).

You could probably find a used Phantom 4 Pro. Very good camera for both
video and stills ("1" sensor). Flight times close to 30 minutes.

The Mavic Pro is better for travel as it folds up quite neatly. Good
flight time (24+ minutes, later versions a slight bit better). In
reality you would fly about 15 - 20 minutes due to safety margins.
There are cheaper options (Mavic "fly") for example - less flight time.

Be careful where you travel. Some destinations may seize the drone on
entry and demand a huge fee to get it back when you leave. Often people
never see their drones again...

I believe you're in Germany? If so, you will need civil liability
insurance and fireproof identification plates affixed to your drone to
fly there. You need to learn the law wherever you fly. (max heights,
exclusion zones, rules over populated areas, etc.)

I own both the original Mavic Pro and the Phantom 4 Pro. Both are very
good - each has its advantages and limitations. Both are very easy to
control (basically are always on autopilot).

That said, a lot of the photography with drones with so called 1"
sensors is stunningly good. (Phantom 4 Pro). Even the Mavic Pro with a
cell phone class sensor (though better lens) can be very good in the
right circumstances.

The real thrill of this, however, is making nice videos.

The real pain of that, however, is video editing, which is 100x more
painful than still editing with a long learning curve.

Thanks for the interesting feedback. I did some more research in the
meantime, and discovered that there are lots of restrictions on using
the drones in many places.

For instance I'm travelling to Algeria at the end of the year, but it
seems impossible for a foreigner to get a flight permit in Algeria.
Which is too bad, because Algeria should have some wildly photogenic
places (especially if you can use a drone).

Then I just checked this map of German flight exclusion zones:
https://map2fly.flynex.de/

Unless I got something wrong, the whole of Munich seems to be a no fly
zone. Also here I was thinking of getting some nice skyline shots with
the Frauenkirche and alps background, but if indeed it's prohibited,
well...

It seems that Germany is not the place to explore drone videography as a
hobby. As far as Munich goes, zooming in on that map shows a few unrestricted
spots in the suburbs, but there is no telling how accessible those might
actually be.

The liability insurance is not a big deal (you can get one for around 30
Euro/year). The aluminium is also not a big deal.

The Mavic 2 Pro is the most likely candidate, but I must say it's still
quite expensive (around 1400 Euro here in Germany).
The only thing which scares me a bit, if this thing has any technical
glitch and falls on the ground from an altitude of 100 metres, it
probably smashes into little pieces and you lose the 1400 Euro you spent
on it. Are these drones reliable, i.e. they won't just fall from the
sky?

Portability for the Mavic 2 Pro seems great, the biggest issue however
are all these restrictions on the use of the drones.

From what I have read the Mavic Air Is probably a better value for the
hobbyist than the Mavic Pro. It is smaller, and less costly.

https://www.dji.com/mavic-air

--
Regards,
Savageduck

Camera drones
 

In article .com,
Savageduck says...
As far as Munich goes, zooming in on that map shows a few unrestricted
spots in the suburbs, but there is no telling how accessible those might
actually be.

In the meantime I found an app (DFS Drohnen App) which tells you exactly
where you can fly or not. Indeed in the centre of Munich there are
places where you can start a drone (for instance in the parks).

snip

From what I have read the Mavic Air Is probably a better value for the
hobbyist than the Mavic Pro. It is smaller, and less costly.

I have considered the Mavic Air for a while, then found a review
complaining about the mediocre image quality of the Mavic Air. There
seems to be a big difference in image quality compared to the Mavic 2
Pro with its 1" sensor and Hasselblad camera unit.
--

Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
https://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
https://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site

Camera drones
 

In article , Alan Browne
says...
When you buy DJI drones, esp. if you are new to the thing, it is
probably best to purchase "DJI Care Refresh" which allows total loss
replacement up to 2 times within 1 year - whether or not it is your
fault (a "fee" each time). In fact they even offered to sell me an
additional year, though I didn't take them up on it.

Sole "catch" is you must return the crashed drone. So if you dump it in
a lake or ocean or simply cannot find it, then that does not apply.

How much does this DJI Care Refresh cost?

snip

Another model to consider is the "Spark". Good enough camera.

Not sure about that. The Spark doesn't even have RAW output (only JPEG).
Then the Air would be a better option (has RAW), because it's not bigger
(the arms of the Spark can't be folded).

However, I was in the shop yesterday and was sort of surprised how tiny
the camera unit of the Spark or even Air actually is. Smartphone sensor
size, probably not bad for daytime shots if 12MP are enough for you, but
I wonder how good the lens is.
--

Alfred Molon

Olympus E-series DSLRs and micro 4/3 forum at
https://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
https://myolympus.org/ photo sharing site

Camera drones
 

On 2018-11-24 11:51, Alfred Molon wrote:
In article , Alan Browne
says...
When you buy DJI drones, esp. if you are new to the thing, it is
probably best to purchase "DJI Care Refresh" which allows total loss
replacement up to 2 times within 1 year - whether or not it is your
fault (a "fee" each time). In fact they even offered to sell me an
additional year, though I didn't take them up on it.

Sole "catch" is you must return the crashed drone. So if you dump it in
a lake or ocean or simply cannot find it, then that does not apply.

How much does this DJI Care Refresh cost?

https://store.dji.com/category/djica...om=buy_now_bar


snip

Another model to consider is the "Spark". Good enough camera.

Not sure about that. The Spark doesn't even have RAW output (only JPEG).

Good enough for most photos. But if you want RAW then go to the Mavic line.

Then the Air would be a better option (has RAW), because it's not bigger
(the arms of the Spark can't be folded).

It's so small, that it's not really needed.


However, I was in the shop yesterday and was sort of surprised how tiny
the camera unit of the Spark or even Air actually is. Smartphone sensor
size, probably not bad for daytime shots if 12MP are enough for you, but
I wonder how good the lens is.

Good enough. Better than most cell phones.

Go online and look at the photography. Lots out there. Some is stunning...



--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester

Camera drones
 

On 2018-11-20 14:02, Alfred Molon wrote:

Aside from the cost, portability also matters, because I would bring the
usual camera gear + the drone on my trips.

Do your research in Germany wrt prices.

For example, in Canada, I would pay about 15% VAT if I bought locally
(indeed, I did for the Mavic Pro).

But if you buy from DJI directly (US$) - shipped from China, they pay
the Canadian VAT and shipping (or did in 2016), so you save
considerably. I did that for the Phantom Pro 4 and the DJI goggles.
Saved a lot.

I don't know how that would apply in Germany.

--
"2/3 of Donald Trump's wives were immigrants. Proof that we
need immigrants to do jobs that most Americans wouldn't do."
- unknown protester